Grimdark - Revision history

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2026-04-16T11:30:40Z

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2026-03-21T14:17:43Z

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195.18.62.142: Undo revision 1008365 by 192.42.116.179 (talk) Go fuck yourself with a chainsword, shithead

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83.8.82.234: /* Literature */

2026-01-01T01:54:52Z

Literature

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:54, 1 January 2026
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	* [[Post Apocalyptic]] stuff in general tends to default to Grimdark.		* [[Post Apocalyptic]] stuff in general tends to default to Grimdark.
	* World Devastators in '''''[[Star Wars]]'''''. Seriously, if you read about them without knowing that they are from Star Wars, you could easily mistake them for something from 40k. And we're not talking about Star Wars Legacy and the genocide of the Mon Calamari.		* World Devastators in '''''[[Star Wars]]'''''. Seriously, if you read about them without knowing that they are from Star Wars, you could easily mistake them for something from 40k. And we're not talking about Star Wars Legacy and the genocide of the Mon Calamari.
	** All of '''Steven Baxter's works''' arguably qualify. '''''Evolution''''' can be summed up as "humanity almost overcame its flaws, fixed the damage it did to Earth, and ushered in a [[noblebright]] future, and it might have worked, but [[Rocks_fall,_everyone_dies\|just then a supervolcano erupted, wiped out human civilization, and everyone died]]. The end. There's even a chapter in the middle of the book outright stating it. Also that humans [[Imperium\|are nothing but vicious bastards who rape, kill, and destroy everything they touch]] and have been ever since our ancestors were rats under the feet of dinosaurs, but other animals aren't much better.
	* '''''[[SCP Foundation]]''''' universe as a whole is borderline grimdark, as many aspects of the Foundation are mixed between absurd comedy, derp, and pure grimdark. At its very worst, the SCP Foundation has things that make the [[Daemonculaba]] look nice by comparison. Above all: [[Inquisition\|Secure. Contain. Protect.]]		* '''''[[SCP Foundation]]''''' universe as a whole is borderline grimdark, as many aspects of the Foundation are mixed between absurd comedy, derp, and pure grimdark. At its very worst, the SCP Foundation has things that make the [[Daemonculaba]] look nice by comparison. Above all: [[Inquisition\|Secure. Contain. Protect.]]
	* '''''Shakespeare's tragedies''''', especially ''Macbeth'' and ''Hamlet''.		* '''''Shakespeare's tragedies''''', especially ''Macbeth'' and ''Hamlet''.
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	* '''''World War Z''''' (the book). After zombies overran most of the world, many people had it so bad that they simply lost the will to live. Fighting in the Paris Catacombs with weaker weapons that wouldn't cause a cave-in due to hazardous gasses everywhere. Russian soldiers rioting over unfair treatment and enforced secrecy ordered under pain of death to kill one in ten of their own squadmates - with rocks - to teach them the price of freedom and democracy. Which they then happily traded away. The survival of the human race hinged on governments following a plan including elements of eugenics and leaving settlements of people behind as zombie bait. People resorted to cannibalism to survive in Canada. North Korea entirely vanished without a trace. Pakistan and Iran nuked each other. After the war officially ended, there are still loose zombies wandering around, Russia has started a breeding program to deal with severe underpopulation, several species are extinct, and diseases thought to be wiped out are coming back en masse.		* '''''World War Z''''' (the book). After zombies overran most of the world, many people had it so bad that they simply lost the will to live. Fighting in the Paris Catacombs with weaker weapons that wouldn't cause a cave-in due to hazardous gasses everywhere. Russian soldiers rioting over unfair treatment and enforced secrecy ordered under pain of death to kill one in ten of their own squadmates - with rocks - to teach them the price of freedom and democracy. Which they then happily traded away. The survival of the human race hinged on governments following a plan including elements of eugenics and leaving settlements of people behind as zombie bait. People resorted to cannibalism to survive in Canada. North Korea entirely vanished without a trace. Pakistan and Iran nuked each other. After the war officially ended, there are still loose zombies wandering around, Russia has started a breeding program to deal with severe underpopulation, several species are extinct, and diseases thought to be wiped out are coming back en masse.
	* Anything from the '''''[[Xeelee Sequence]]'''''.		* Anything from the '''''[[Xeelee Sequence]]'''''.
			** All of '''Steven Baxter's works''' arguably qualify. '''''Evolution''''' can be summed up as "humanity almost overcame its flaws, fixed the damage it did to Earth, and ushered in a [[noblebright]] future, and it might have worked, but [[Rocks_fall,_everyone_dies\|just then a supervolcano erupted, wiped out human civilization, and everyone died]]. The end. There's even a chapter in the middle of the book outright stating it. Also that humans [[Imperium\|are nothing but vicious bastards who rape, kill, and destroy everything they touch]] and have been ever since our ancestors were rats under the feet of dinosaurs, but other animals aren't much better.

	===Films and TV===		===Films and TV===

Pachinko Man at 23:39, 31 July 2025

2025-07-31T23:39:33Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:39, 31 July 2025
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	{{Grimdark}}		{{Grimdark}}
			{{Autism}}
	[[File:P23436_p_v10_aa.jpg\|300px\|right\|thumb\|If your protagonist or antagonist isn't at least this [[edgy]], then you're probably doing Grimdark wrong.]]		[[File:P23436_p_v10_aa.jpg\|300px\|right\|thumb\|If your protagonist or antagonist isn't at least this [[edgy]], then you're probably doing Grimdark wrong.]]
	[[Image:Lovepeace.png\|thumb\|right\|It's totally the opposite of this.]][[Image:Inspector Grimgadget.jpg\|thumb\|right\|Inspector Gadget, reimagined with a grimdark feel.]]		[[Image:Lovepeace.png\|thumb\|right\|It's totally the opposite of this.]][[Image:Inspector Grimgadget.jpg\|thumb\|right\|Inspector Gadget, reimagined with a grimdark feel.]]

Sdhjk: /* Warhammer 40K */

2025-07-30T16:56:51Z

Warhammer 40K

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:56, 30 July 2025
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	*To be honest, the whole idea of humans being the "teeming multitudes" faction [[Imperial Guard\|winning battles by sheer weight of numbers]] and which [[Skaven\|breed quickly and are easily replaced]] is kind of silly if you know anything about human reproduction. Among species on Earth, humans are notable for being one of the ''slowest'' reproducing species out there. It takes nine months for a human to gestate to maturity in the womb, more than any other animal aside from elephants and whales, and even after birth, humans take longer to reach maturity. Additionally, it takes a huge amount of parental care to care for a child and raise them to functional adulthood, more than any other animal. On top of this, pregnancy is incredibly crippling for human females, and women have a one in three chance of dying in childbirth if giving birth without any external aid or midwives (as would be the case for a citizen of the underhives), something almost no other species has to deal with. The way our species generally works is we breed incredibly slowly but live an incredibly long time and invest a lot of resources to make sure those few that are born survive to adulthood, which basically makes us the [[elves]] of the animal kingdom. Heck, we got to a population of over 6 billion on Earth mainly through dramatically reducing early-life mortality rates, not accelerated birth rates (if anything, birth rates have ''declined'' in most developed nations). Barring some major technological breakthrough like artificial wombs or genetic engineering to reduce the crippling side effects of human pregnancy or long adolescence, humans are unlikely to be able to outbreed ''anything'' (except maybe [[Eldar]]). And while some factions in the Imperium do have access to artificial wombs (like the [[Mechanicus]]), most of humanity in 40k are shown to still be reproducing the old fashioned way. Even if humanity starts out with a huge population it can throw at any problem, that population is going to be depleted pretty fast because humanity [[Eldar\|can't replace their losses]]. Even if they are the greatest resource the Imperium has, they're still trying to fight a war of attrition against foes including [[Daemons\|ones who can't even be properly killed]] and two races who can easily outbreed humanity; [[Orks\|one reproduces by fighting]] and [[Tyranids\|the other are a rapidly reproducing horde of space locusts who go from conception to combat-ready within a Terran week]]. However, fans tend to ignore this because of the whole “to be a man in such times is to be one amongst untold billions” thing that is part of the general lack of regard for human life that makes 40k 40k, so people give it a pass.		*To be honest, the whole idea of humans being the "teeming multitudes" faction [[Imperial Guard\|winning battles by sheer weight of numbers]] and which [[Skaven\|breed quickly and are easily replaced]] is kind of silly if you know anything about human reproduction. Among species on Earth, humans are notable for being one of the ''slowest'' reproducing species out there. It takes nine months for a human to gestate to maturity in the womb, more than any other animal aside from elephants and whales, and even after birth, humans take longer to reach maturity. Additionally, it takes a huge amount of parental care to care for a child and raise them to functional adulthood, more than any other animal. On top of this, pregnancy is incredibly crippling for human females, and women have a one in three chance of dying in childbirth if giving birth without any external aid or midwives (as would be the case for a citizen of the underhives), something almost no other species has to deal with. The way our species generally works is we breed incredibly slowly but live an incredibly long time and invest a lot of resources to make sure those few that are born survive to adulthood, which basically makes us the [[elves]] of the animal kingdom. Heck, we got to a population of over 6 billion on Earth mainly through dramatically reducing early-life mortality rates, not accelerated birth rates (if anything, birth rates have ''declined'' in most developed nations). Barring some major technological breakthrough like artificial wombs or genetic engineering to reduce the crippling side effects of human pregnancy or long adolescence, humans are unlikely to be able to outbreed ''anything'' (except maybe [[Eldar]]). And while some factions in the Imperium do have access to artificial wombs (like the [[Mechanicus]]), most of humanity in 40k are shown to still be reproducing the old fashioned way. Even if humanity starts out with a huge population it can throw at any problem, that population is going to be depleted pretty fast because humanity [[Eldar\|can't replace their losses]]. Even if they are the greatest resource the Imperium has, they're still trying to fight a war of attrition against foes including [[Daemons\|ones who can't even be properly killed]] and two races who can easily outbreed humanity; [[Orks\|one reproduces by fighting]] and [[Tyranids\|the other are a rapidly reproducing horde of space locusts who go from conception to combat-ready within a Terran week]]. However, fans tend to ignore this because of the whole “to be a man in such times is to be one amongst untold billions” thing that is part of the general lack of regard for human life that makes 40k 40k, so people give it a pass.
	** Actually, [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WMG/Warhammer40000 there is a theory that explains this]. [[TL;DR]]: Imperium Of Man humans are '''not''' ''Homo Sapiens'', but superior ''Homo Vitiosus''; this (sub)species of Humans is more tough, strong, agile, aggressive, and generally superior to modern humans — and it '''breeds more rapidly than modern humans'''. While it takes a long time to grow ''Homo Sapiens'' to adulthood, ''Homo Vitiosus'' reaches it much quicker — presumably, in less than 4 years, and '''most likely''' in a few months — birthing a dozen children (or ''multiple dozens'') at the same time is considered '''normal''', and children themselves can take care of themselves from the get-go, as they can walk, orient in space, work at factory, and fight '''from birth''' (basically, newborn ''Homo Vitiosus'' is at least as capable as 8-10 years old ''Homo Sapiens''; in other interpretation, they behave as '''smaller adults''', have adult mentality, and are just as violent and aggressive as adult ''Homo Vitiosus'').		** Actually, [https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/WMG/Warhammer40000 there is a theory that explains this]. [[TL;DR]]: Imperium Of Man humans are '''not''' ''Homo Sapiens'', but superior ''Homo Vitiosus''; this (sub)species of Humans is more tough, strong, agile, aggressive, and generally superior to modern humans — and it '''breeds more rapidly than modern humans'''. While it takes a long time to grow ''Homo Sapiens'' to adulthood, ''Homo Vitiosus'' reaches it much quicker — presumably, in less than 4 years, and '''most likely''' in a few months — birthing a dozen children (or ''multiple dozens'') at the same time is considered '''normal''', and children themselves can take care of themselves from the get-go, as they can walk, orient in space, work at factory, and fight '''from birth''' (basically, newborn ''Homo Vitiosus'' is at least as capable as 8-10 years old ''Homo Sapiens''; in other interpretation, they behave as '''smaller adults''', have adult mentality, and are just as violent and aggressive as adult ''Homo Vitiosus'').
	** There's some quick math. As for "Fifteen Hours" WH40K book (about misadventures of guardsman), the average guardsman lives for about 15.7 hours on the battlefield. Therefore, to supply a single job with manpower, you need ≈558 (actually 558,34729201563372417643774427694) guardsmen per year. Therefore, to make sure ''a single'' 1000000-men strong army is running, it would require ≈558347292 guardsmen per year; obviously, there will be ''multiple'' such armies running around. And in WH40K, wars go for thousands of years non-stop. Mind you, each one of those guardsmen must be equipped, trained, fed, healed — that's '''an awful lot''' of people working on this. You need full industry chains from ore to weapons, farmers to make food, logistics to move all this around, training center where guardsmen train, police and garrison to protect all this, Mechanicus to make sure tech doesn't regress faster than normally, bureaucracy to manage all this, etc. And all those "supports" in the rear also die like flies — so, they also need lots of replacement workers and technicians... All in all, the amount of people required seems to be a lot bigger than the amount of people available.		** There's some quick math. As for "Fifteen Hours" WH40K book (about misadventures of guardsman), the average guardsman lives for about 15.7 hours on the battlefield. Therefore, to supply a single job with manpower, you need ≈558 (actually 558,34729201563372417643774427694) guardsmen per year. Therefore, to make sure ''a single'' 1000000-men strong army is running, it would require ≈558347292 guardsmen per year; obviously, there will be ''multiple'' such armies running around. And in WH40K, wars go for thousands of years non-stop. Mind you, each one of those guardsmen must be equipped, trained, fed, healed — that's '''an awful lot''' of people working on this. You need full industry chains from ore to weapons, farmers to make food, logistics to move all this around, training center where guardsmen train, police and garrison to protect all this, Mechanicus to make sure tech doesn't regress faster than normally, bureaucracy to manage all this, etc. And all those "supports" in the rear also die like flies — so, they also need lots of replacement workers and technicians... All in all, [[Scale Inconsistency\|the amount of people required seems to be a lot bigger than the amount of people available]].
	*** More math: some 40k sources claim that millions if not billions of guardsmen are killed EVERY SECOND. A year is 31557600 seconds. Therefore, '''every year''', either ≈3155760000000000000000 (315576 * 10^16; if "millions die"; number is Sextilions Short Scale or Trilliards Long Scale), ≈3155760000000000000000000000 (315576 * 10^19; if "billions die", Short Scale; number is Septillions Short Scale or Quadrillions Long Scale) or ≈3155760000000000000000000000000000 (315576 * 10^21; if "billions die", Long Scale; number is Octillions Short Scale or Quadrilliard Long Scale) of guardsmen die every year. That's enough to constantly field either ≈5651966160000010000, or ≈5651966160000010000000000, or ≈5651966160000010000000000000000 guardsmen respectively. That's ''just guardsmen alone'' — as explained above, for every guardsman, there's countless "supports" who work, research, and produce. Imperium has over 1 million known worlds; therefore, on average, '''each world''' must yearly provide either ≈3155760000000000 (315576 * 10^10; if "millions die") or ≈3155760000000000000 (315576 * 10^13; if "billions die", Short Scale) ≈3155760000000000000000 (315576 * 10^16; if "billions die", Long Scale) guardsmen. For comparison: modern day Earth has total population of ≈8221439045 (≈822143,9045 * 10^4; ''at least'' 6 orders of magnitude less than required). This doesn't take the "unknown" worlds into account - but at the same time, it doesn't take "unknown" armies into account either. And all that is just the [[Astra Militarum]] - we didn't yet factor in the Marines, Mechanicus, PDF Troopers, and all other military organizations of Imperium.		*** More math: some 40k sources claim that millions if not billions of guardsmen are killed EVERY SECOND. A year is 31557600 seconds. Therefore, '''every year''', either ≈3155760000000000000000 (315576 * 10^16; if "millions die"; number is Sextilions Short Scale or Trilliards Long Scale), ≈3155760000000000000000000000 (315576 * 10^19; if "billions die", Short Scale; number is Septillions Short Scale or Quadrillions Long Scale) or ≈3155760000000000000000000000000000 (315576 * 10^21; if "billions die", Long Scale; number is Octillions Short Scale or Quadrilliard Long Scale) of guardsmen die every year. That's enough to constantly field either ≈5651966160000010000, or ≈5651966160000010000000000, or ≈5651966160000010000000000000000 guardsmen respectively. That's ''just guardsmen alone'' — as explained above, for every guardsman, there's countless "supports" who work, research, and produce. Imperium has over 1 million known worlds; therefore, on average, '''each world''' must yearly provide either ≈3155760000000000 (315576 * 10^10; if "millions die") or ≈3155760000000000000 (315576 * 10^13; if "billions die", Short Scale) ≈3155760000000000000000 (315576 * 10^16; if "billions die", Long Scale) guardsmen. For comparison: modern day Earth has total population of ≈8221439045 (≈822143,9045 * 10^4; ''at least'' 6 orders of magnitude less than required). This doesn't take the "unknown" worlds into account - but at the same time, it doesn't take "unknown" armies into account either. And all that is just the [[Astra Militarum]] - we didn't yet factor in the Marines, Mechanicus, PDF Troopers, and all other military organizations of Imperium.
	* Some 40k sources claim that millions if not billions of guardsmen are killed EVERY SECOND. Even with the scale of the Imperium taken into the account, having many times the current population of the Earth die every minute would be ridiculous for the whole of the Imperium, let alone just the Imperial Guard. As with many things [[GW]], the scale is either way too small to believably make a difference or blown well out of proportions.		* Some 40k sources claim that millions if not billions of guardsmen are killed EVERY SECOND. Even with the scale of the Imperium taken into the account, having many times the current population of the Earth die every minute would be ridiculous for the whole of the Imperium, let alone just the Imperial Guard. As with many things [[GW]], the scale is either way too small to believably make a difference or blown well out of proportions.

Sdhjk: /* Warhammer 40K */ tried to update the page.

2025-07-30T16:52:14Z

Warhammer 40K: tried to update the page.

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Sdhjk: /* /tg/ */

2025-07-30T16:36:52Z

/tg/

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