Imperial Truth - Revision history

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1d4chan>TheSpoilerHeretic: /* Primarch's point of view */

2023-06-10T02:12:47Z

Primarch's point of view

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:12, 10 June 2023
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	Magnus said that the Warp is just another type of knowledge to be used. The Warp, in turn, made him its bitch. Even ignoring that, there is nothing "possible, observable, and repeatable" when it comes to the Warp (before Mortarion fell to Chaos he believed this and attempted to put it into practice, which got him fucked up by a Daemon he wanted to interrogate), and many other things in 40k. It's well, chaotic, the hate, anger and madness of uncountable beings in the Galaxy. There is nothing rational about the emotional refuse of sentience, and trying to apply scientific principles to them is a waste of time at the absolute best.		Magnus said that the Warp is just another type of knowledge to be used. The Warp, in turn, made him its bitch. Even ignoring that, there is nothing "possible, observable, and repeatable" when it comes to the Warp (before Mortarion fell to Chaos he believed this and attempted to put it into practice, which got him fucked up by a Daemon he wanted to interrogate), and many other things in 40k. It's well, chaotic, the hate, anger and madness of uncountable beings in the Galaxy. There is nothing rational about the emotional refuse of sentience, and trying to apply scientific principles to them is a waste of time at the absolute best.

	During Jaghatai Khan's first visit on Terra (which he had refused from time to time), he had a attended a meeting with Malcador (Who the Khan did not hold high esteem just like his father; the meeting was only possible because his psyker buddy Yesugei convinced him to attend) to ~~disscus~~ the Imperial Truth. Khan believed it was a giant hypocritical load of bullshit that would at best delay [[chaos\|the inevitable]], and at worst be a form of slavery not unlike the one he overthrew on Chogoris. Malcador replied by saying the lie is noble and necessary, which is why they need the Primarch to get off their asses and conquer planets ASAP before the lie expired.		During Jaghatai Khan's first visit on Terra (which he had refused to visit from time to time), he had attended a meeting with Malcador (Who the Khan did not hold high esteem of just like his father; the meeting was only possible because his psyker buddy '''Yesugei''' convinced him to attend) to discuss the Imperial Truth. Khan believed it was a giant hypocritical load of bullshit that would at best delay [[chaos\|the inevitable]], and at worst be a form of slavery not unlike the one he overthrew on Chogoris. Malcador replied by saying the lie is noble and necessary, which is why they need the Primarch to get off their asses and conquer planets ASAP before the lie expired.

	Pre-Heresy Mortarion hated psykers and supported the edict of Nikea, but also hated the Imperial Truth because he quickly realized how bullshit it was after noticing that the law's main architects were uber powerful psykers experimenting with [[Golden Throne\|warp-tech]]. It was a hypocrisy that the Mortarion of old couldn't overlook.		Pre-Heresy Mortarion hated psykers and supported the edict of Nikea, but also hated the Imperial Truth because he quickly realized how bullshit it was after noticing that the law's main architects were uber powerful psykers experimenting with [[Golden Throne\|warp-tech]]. It was a hypocrisy that the Mortarion of old couldn't overlook.


	[[Guilliman]] himself still believes in (at least modified version of) it after his return, and after being saved by a Living Saint during the Plague Wars he's seriously started to wonder if Lorgar and the Ecclesiarchy actually had it right all along. Even if he genuinely believed that the Emperor was telling the truth when he told Lorgar that he was no god, its entirely possible that he may more or less have become a god in his current state. He doesn't worship him, but does recognize that if he wasn't a god back then, he definitely is now.		[[Guilliman]] himself still believes in (at least modified version of) it after his return, and after being saved by a Living Saint during the Plague Wars he's seriously started to wonder if Lorgar and the Ecclesiarchy actually had it right all along. Even if he genuinely believed that the Emperor was telling the truth when he told Lorgar that he was no god, its entirely possible that he may more or less have become a god in his current state. He doesn't worship him, but does recognize that if he wasn't a god back then, he definitely is now.

2604:2D80:A085:E600:1C4C:4B3F:4367:1976 at 05:18, 8 June 2023

2023-06-08T05:18:06Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 05:18, 8 June 2023
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	That said, how strongly the Imperial Truth was enforced very clearly varied from Legion to Legion. Case-in-point: Word Bearers. And religious people clearly still lived in the Great Crusade as something to ridicule by the government though to what degree of secrecy varied dramatically wherever they were. By and large, it seems likely the Imperium took the approach that if your religion can be disproven, it will be destroyed, if your religion cannot be disproven (such as belief in God creating everything or an afterlife) then active worship will be banned (probably for fear of split loyalties between religious and secular authorities which admittedly has caused a number of hardships in human history) and anyone believing in the religion would be mocked as weirdos. A “happy” balance between “feed the Christians/Jews to lions” and State Atheism in which religion can be ruthlessly purged but when the Imperium cannot actually disprove a religious belief it didn’t just murderize everyone...unless the Emperor was personally leading the conquest of your world. Then yeah, he’d totally kill everyone but Monarchia seems to imply he grew out of that after realizing the scope or he’d have killed everyone there instead of evacuating them before destroying it.		That said, how strongly the Imperial Truth was enforced very clearly varied from Legion to Legion. Case-in-point: Word Bearers. And religious people clearly still lived in the Great Crusade as something to ridicule by the government though to what degree of secrecy varied dramatically wherever they were. By and large, it seems likely the Imperium took the approach that if your religion can be disproven, it will be destroyed, if your religion cannot be disproven (such as belief in God creating everything or an afterlife) then active worship will be banned (probably for fear of split loyalties between religious and secular authorities which admittedly has caused a number of hardships in human history) and anyone believing in the religion would be mocked as weirdos. A “happy” balance between “feed the Christians/Jews to lions” and State Atheism in which religion can be ruthlessly purged but when the Imperium cannot actually disprove a religious belief it didn’t just murderize everyone...unless the Emperor was personally leading the conquest of your world. Then yeah, he’d totally kill everyone but Monarchia seems to imply he grew out of that after realizing the scope or he’d have killed everyone there instead of evacuating them before destroying it.

	The Emperor not destroying the Machine Cult makes sense in this context. Allowing the worship of knowledge and science is basically worship of the Imperial Truth, which is something it's not surprising he'd tolerate. Allowing worship of "love thy neighbor" and "you go to a happy place when you die" probably wouldn't have bothered him either. Allowing worship of "lightning comes from an old ~~due~~ on a mountain throwing bolts like javelins" isn't tolerable.		The Emperor not destroying the Machine Cult makes sense in this context. Allowing the worship of knowledge and science is basically worship of the Imperial Truth, which is something it's not surprising he'd tolerate. Allowing worship of "love thy neighbor" and "you go to a happy place when you die" probably wouldn't have bothered him either. Allowing worship of "lightning comes from an old dude on a mountain throwing bolts like javelins" isn't tolerable.

	Though there is the implication that the Emperor arranged for the Machine Cult being created during the DAoT. See the [[Omnissiah]] for the theories.		Though there is the implication that the Emperor arranged for the Machine Cult being created during the DAoT. See the [[Omnissiah]] for the theories.

1d4chan>TheSpoilerHeretic: /* Primarch's point of view */

2023-06-07T04:15:22Z

Primarch's point of view

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:15, 7 June 2023
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	Magnus said that the Warp is just another type of knowledge to be used. The Warp, in turn, made him its bitch. Even ignoring that, there is nothing "possible, observable, and repeatable" when it comes to the Warp (before Mortarion fell to Chaos he believed this and attempted to put it into practice, which got him fucked up by a Daemon he wanted to interrogate), and many other things in 40k. It's well, chaotic, the hate, anger and madness of uncountable beings in the Galaxy. There is nothing rational about the emotional refuse of sentience, and trying to apply scientific principles to them is a waste of time at the absolute best.		Magnus said that the Warp is just another type of knowledge to be used. The Warp, in turn, made him its bitch. Even ignoring that, there is nothing "possible, observable, and repeatable" when it comes to the Warp (before Mortarion fell to Chaos he believed this and attempted to put it into practice, which got him fucked up by a Daemon he wanted to interrogate), and many other things in 40k. It's well, chaotic, the hate, anger and madness of uncountable beings in the Galaxy. There is nothing rational about the emotional refuse of sentience, and trying to apply scientific principles to them is a waste of time at the absolute best.

			During Jaghatai Khan's first visit on Terra (which he had refused from time to time), he had a attended a meeting with Malcador (Who the Khan did not hold high esteem just like his father; the meeting was only possible because his psyker buddy Yesugei convinced him to attend) to disscus the Imperial Truth. Khan believed it was a giant hypocritical load of bullshit that would at best delay [[chaos\|the inevitable]], and at worst be a form of slavery not unlike the one he overthrew on Chogoris. Malcador replied by saying the lie is noble and necessary, which is why they need the Primarch to get off their asses and conquer planets ASAP before the lie expired.
	Jaghatai Khan ~~didn~~'~~t have a great time during his~~ first visit on Terra~~. He kept butting heads~~ with ~~his father, and didn't~~ hold ~~Malcador in~~ high esteem~~. Only~~ his psyker buddy Yesugei convinced him to attend ~~a meeting that Khan kept delaying. Malcador and Jaghatai would then discuss~~ the Imperial Truth. Khan believed it was a giant hypocritical load of bullshit that would at best delay [[chaos\|the inevitable]], and at worst be a form of slavery not unlike the one he overthrew on Chogoris. Malcador replied by saying the lie is noble and necessary, which is why they need the Primarch to get off their asses and conquer planets ASAP before the lie expired.

	Pre-Heresy Mortarion hated psykers and supported the edict of Nikea, but also hated the Imperial Truth because he quickly realized how bullshit it was after noticing that the law's main architects were uber powerful psykers experimenting with [[Golden Throne\|warp-tech]]. It was a hypocrisy that the Mortarion of old couldn't overlook.		Pre-Heresy Mortarion hated psykers and supported the edict of Nikea, but also hated the Imperial Truth because he quickly realized how bullshit it was after noticing that the law's main architects were uber powerful psykers experimenting with [[Golden Throne\|warp-tech]]. It was a hypocrisy that the Mortarion of old couldn't overlook.

2A02:1810:4E2C:A900:D0CE:2E1B:F4C:B99C at 16:11, 6 June 2023

2023-06-06T16:11:09Z

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12.146.116.155: Undo revision 849085 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

2022-09-25T07:29:50Z

Undo revision 849085 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:29, 25 September 2022
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	That, and killing the people smart enough to actually learn things instead of assuming "common knowledge" is magically right and reject logic and reason to not feel dumb doesn't exactly encourage the Emperor's vision for humanity.		That, and killing the people smart enough to actually learn things instead of assuming "common knowledge" is magically right and reject logic and reason to not feel dumb doesn't exactly encourage the Emperor's vision for humanity.

	That said, how strongly the Imperial Truth was enforced very clearly varied from Legion to Legion. Case-in-point: Word Bearers. And religious people clearly still lived in the Great Crusade as something to ridicule by the government though to what degree of secrecy varied dramatically wherever they were. By and large, it seems likely the Imperium took the approach that if your religion can be disproven, it will be destroyed, if your religion cannot be disproven (such as belief in God creating everything or an afterlife) then active worship will be banned or at least the religious organization since stopping prayer is impossible and therefore pointless to even attempt and the Imperium didn't seem to destroy knowledge of religious beliefs and their writings (~~the banning was~~ probably for fear of split loyalties between religious and secular authorities which admittedly has caused a number of hardships in human history) and anyone believing in the religion would be mocked as weirdos ~~but otherwise unharmed~~. A “happy” balance between “feed the Christians/Jews to lions” and State Atheism in which religion can be ruthlessly purged but when the Imperium cannot actually disprove a religious belief it didn’t just murderize everyone...unless the Emperor was personally leading the conquest of your world. Then yeah, he’d totally kill everyone ~~like he did on Earth,~~ but Monarchia seems to imply he grew out of that after realizing the scope or he’d have killed everyone there instead of evacuating them before destroying it ~~or he saw them as victims of his own prior inaction and felt guilty~~.		That said, how strongly the Imperial Truth was enforced very clearly varied from Legion to Legion. Case-in-point: Word Bearers. And religious people clearly still lived in the Great Crusade as something to ridicule by the government though to what degree of secrecy varied dramatically wherever they were. By and large, it seems likely the Imperium took the approach that if your religion can be disproven, it will be destroyed, if your religion cannot be disproven (such as belief in God creating everything or an afterlife) then active worship will be banned (probably for fear of split loyalties between religious and secular authorities which admittedly has caused a number of hardships in human history) and anyone believing in the religion would be mocked as weirdos. A “happy” balance between “feed the Christians/Jews to lions” and State Atheism in which religion can be ruthlessly purged but when the Imperium cannot actually disprove a religious belief it didn’t just murderize everyone...unless the Emperor was personally leading the conquest of your world. Then yeah, he’d totally kill everyone but Monarchia seems to imply he grew out of that after realizing the scope or he’d have killed everyone there instead of evacuating them before destroying it.

	The Emperor not destroying the Machine Cult makes sense in this context. Allowing the worship of knowledge and science is basically worship of the Imperial Truth, which is something it's not surprising he'd tolerate. Allowing worship of "love thy neighbor" and "you go to a happy place when you die" probably wouldn't have bothered him either. Allowing worship of "lightning comes from an old due on a mountain throwing bolts like javelins" isn't tolerable. To be fair, a lot of people have been driven to do terrible things in the name of Allah or whatever else because their self-proclaimed religious leaders lied to them out of personal benefit. To be further fair, this has historically been extremely rare and nearly all hardship in human history has been from secularism and every atheist nation to thus far exist has become a tyrannical hellhole.		The Emperor not destroying the Machine Cult makes sense in this context. Allowing the worship of knowledge and science is basically worship of the Imperial Truth, which is something it's not surprising he'd tolerate. Allowing worship of "love thy neighbor" and "you go to a happy place when you die" probably wouldn't have bothered him either. Allowing worship of "lightning comes from an old due on a mountain throwing bolts like javelins" isn't tolerable.

	Though there is the implication that the Emperor arranged for the Machine Cult being created during the DAoT. See the [[Omnissiah]] for the theories.		Though there is the implication that the Emperor arranged for the Machine Cult being created during the DAoT. See the [[Omnissiah]] for the theories.

12.146.116.155: Undo revision 849086 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

2022-09-25T07:29:38Z

Undo revision 849086 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:29, 25 September 2022
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	Perhaps it was more than anything the fact the Emperor knew in his heart of hearts too many people resented the Great Crusade, as in all wars there is a losing side, even if they became part of the Imperium there is still lots of people who saw their worlds shattered, they would be the first ones to give Chaos a try, not because they need to believe in something but as an attempt to escape their deplorable condition and take revenge upon those who enslaved them.		Perhaps it was more than anything the fact the Emperor knew in his heart of hearts too many people resented the Great Crusade, as in all wars there is a losing side, even if they became part of the Imperium there is still lots of people who saw their worlds shattered, they would be the first ones to give Chaos a try, not because they need to believe in something but as an attempt to escape their deplorable condition and take revenge upon those who enslaved them.

	Although, something in the lore supposedly claims the Emperor said he kept Chaos a secret because he feared his sons would try to conquer it. Which would have ended predictably for them and then humanity.

	If the Imperial Truth is even known about by the time of 40k is uncertain, although more than likely the term is now used as pro-imperial propaganda by Imperial Missionaries trying to sell worship of the Emperor to disbelieving locals on your newly discovered savage world. In fact the novel Hammer & Anvil flat-out says that's what it is. Some [[Chaos Space Marine\|Chaos Space Marines]] might remember it, but due to their worship of the [[Chaos Gods]] none of them follow it, with the exception of [[Fabius Bile]].		If the Imperial Truth is even known about by the time of 40k is uncertain, although more than likely the term is now used as pro-imperial propaganda by Imperial Missionaries trying to sell worship of the Emperor to disbelieving locals on your newly discovered savage world. In fact the novel Hammer & Anvil flat-out says that's what it is. Some [[Chaos Space Marine\|Chaos Space Marines]] might remember it, but due to their worship of the [[Chaos Gods]] none of them follow it, with the exception of [[Fabius Bile]].

12.146.116.155: Undo revision 849087 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

2022-09-25T07:29:22Z

Undo revision 849087 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:29, 25 September 2022
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	Still, why wasn't the Emprah more straightforward? He could have said: "There are no gods, just alien dimension energy beings that are so fucked up, they think they are Gods. They are lying and will fuck you over." But he probably didn't do that since the whole idea of the Great Crusade was to eliminate such creatures, and telling everyone about them like that would only lead to overzealous idiots making contact with 'the monsters' in an attempt to cage or eliminate them (a trait [[Fulgrim\|sadly]] [[Angron\|common]] [[Jaghatai Khan\|in]] [[Mortarion\|his]] [[Konrad Curze\|sons]]), and that would open its own can of worms. Another reason for him not to tell anyone is that what counts as a "god" is entirely up to each individual person. To the Greeks, Zeus and Poseidon were gods. To the Christians, Zeus and Poseidon either do not exist or do not count as gods because they are more limited than the Christian God. It's all subjective, which means telling people about Chaos and daemons would still cause huge numbers of people to decide they're gods which A) would make them stronger due to that belief even if the believers hated them and tried to fight against them and B) a lot of the people would start worshiping and following them like wet-rot under the carpet.		Still, why wasn't the Emprah more straightforward? He could have said: "There are no gods, just alien dimension energy beings that are so fucked up, they think they are Gods. They are lying and will fuck you over." But he probably didn't do that since the whole idea of the Great Crusade was to eliminate such creatures, and telling everyone about them like that would only lead to overzealous idiots making contact with 'the monsters' in an attempt to cage or eliminate them (a trait [[Fulgrim\|sadly]] [[Angron\|common]] [[Jaghatai Khan\|in]] [[Mortarion\|his]] [[Konrad Curze\|sons]]), and that would open its own can of worms. Another reason for him not to tell anyone is that what counts as a "god" is entirely up to each individual person. To the Greeks, Zeus and Poseidon were gods. To the Christians, Zeus and Poseidon either do not exist or do not count as gods because they are more limited than the Christian God. It's all subjective, which means telling people about Chaos and daemons would still cause huge numbers of people to decide they're gods which A) would make them stronger due to that belief even if the believers hated them and tried to fight against them and B) a lot of the people would start worshiping and following them like wet-rot under the carpet.

	Unfortunately for the Emperor, Chaos has since proven quite capably that it doesn't need to be known about to whisper in people's ear. So, keeping it secret was completely pointless even if he had been right.

	The Emprah's own biggest fuck up was not trusting Mankind or even his own Primarchs to be able to cope with the actual truth of the matter, the existence of eldritch entities in general without falling on our knees to worship them. Extra stupid points since the war against the Men of Iron happened after a ''daemonic invasion'' of human space, to say nothing of the Age of Strife's frequent wars against daemons. Humanity had more than proven that we weren't going to join the fuckers. The Emprah was like a manager that hides vital information from his employees because he doesn't think they can cope with the big picture, then the company falls apart when an engineer pisses off a major customer because of some unknown piece of said info. That is WH40K in a nutshell.		The Emprah's own biggest fuck up was not trusting Mankind or even his own Primarchs to be able to cope with the actual truth of the matter, the existence of eldritch entities in general without falling on our knees to worship them. Extra stupid points since the war against the Men of Iron happened after a ''daemonic invasion'' of human space, to say nothing of the Age of Strife's frequent wars against daemons. Humanity had more than proven that we weren't going to join the fuckers. The Emprah was like a manager that hides vital information from his employees because he doesn't think they can cope with the big picture, then the company falls apart when an engineer pisses off a major customer because of some unknown piece of said info. That is WH40K in a nutshell.

12.146.116.155: Undo revision 849088 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

2022-09-25T07:28:56Z

Undo revision 849088 by 217.180.196.10 (talk)

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:28, 25 September 2022
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	The Imperial Truth is the atheist rationalist doctrine espoused by the [[God-Emperor of Mankind\|Emperor of Mankind]] as part of the [[Great Crusade]]. According to the Imperial Truth, the Emperor believed that religion and superstition had divided mankind too much during its history. On one hand, the Emperor had reason to believe since he'd lived through most of [[Earth\|Terra]]'s religious wars (although his statements about them in The Last Church implies he either actually didn't bother knowing anything about them or he was purposefully lying to try and win an argument, both sound like him). On the other hand, these were motivated by secular reasons, defensive responses or fanatics who would have simply attached their obsession to something else if they had no religion at the time. Thus did the Emperor [[The Last Church\|become an extreme militant atheist who violently purged the religions of Terra]]. His plan was for [[Imperium of Man]] to become a secular state [[Star Trek\|espousing science and reason]] (based on the Emperor's conjectures linking religious worship to the powers of Chaos, as seen below). Although, the science and reason thing didn't shake the religious trappings and presence (such as angelic figures, daemons, and various vernacular and art quirks of the Imperium).		The Imperial Truth is the atheist rationalist doctrine espoused by the [[God-Emperor of Mankind\|Emperor of Mankind]] as part of the [[Great Crusade]]. According to the Imperial Truth, the Emperor believed that religion and superstition had divided mankind too much during its history. On one hand, the Emperor had reason to believe since he'd lived through most of [[Earth\|Terra]]'s religious wars (although his statements about them in The Last Church implies he either actually didn't bother knowing anything about them or he was purposefully lying to try and win an argument, both sound like him). On the other hand, these were motivated by secular reasons, defensive responses or fanatics who would have simply attached their obsession to something else if they had no religion at the time. Thus did the Emperor [[The Last Church\|become an extreme militant atheist who violently purged the religions of Terra]]. His plan was for [[Imperium of Man]] to become a secular state [[Star Trek\|espousing science and reason]] (based on the Emperor's conjectures linking religious worship to the powers of Chaos, as seen below). Although, the science and reason thing didn't shake the religious trappings and presence (such as angelic figures, daemons, and various vernacular and art quirks of the Imperium).

	Unsurprising; it's easy to convince someone that there is no buff guy in the sky throwing lightning bolts when you can prove it, but when confronted with something like "everything exist because God says so, the end" you can't really disprove it since anything you use was "created by God" or religions focused on an afterlife because A) can't be dis-proven even in 40K and B) souls actually ''do'' go to ''the other side of the Warp'' assuming nothing catches them and so that would actually ''encourage'' afterlife religious belief. Following the [[Horus Heresy]] and the Emperor's internment on the Golden Throne, the Imperial Truth collapsed, the Emperor's very own philosophy denounced as [[HERESY]] wherever it was not simply forgotten, and the Imperium of Man has become [[Grimdark\|a theocratic dictatorship where questioning anything results in a painful death]]. So, ~~'''~~exactly what the Emperor wanted just with worship instead of atheism as its official religious belief.~~'''~~		Unsurprising; it's easy to convince someone that there is no buff guy in the sky throwing lightning bolts when you can prove it, but when confronted with something like "everything exist because God says so, the end" you can't really disprove it since anything you use was "created by God" or religions focused on an afterlife because A) can't be dis-proven even in 40K and B) souls actually ''do'' go to ''the other side of the Warp'' assuming nothing catches them and so that would actually ''encourage'' afterlife religious belief. Following the [[Horus Heresy]] and the Emperor's internment on the Golden Throne, the Imperial Truth collapsed, the Emperor's very own philosophy denounced as [[HERESY]] wherever it was not simply forgotten, and the Imperium of Man has become [[Grimdark\|a theocratic dictatorship where questioning anything results in a painful death]]. So, exactly what the Emperor wanted just with worship instead of atheism as its official religious belief.

	Its probable that, given the massive proliferation of Chaos-lite cults throughout the galaxy after the Age of Strife, from tribal practices that wouldn't be out of place in [[Norsca]] to [[Colchis\|complete theocracies]], the Emperor didn't want to take any chances and just banned any religious practices regardless of whether or not they were more or less obviously connected to Chaos. Even in the 40th millennium, part of their modus operandi still involves infiltrating and corrupting otherwise legitimate religious and philosophical institutions, after all. However, that is only due to how common they are. Secular organizations are just as vulnerable. More so, even, due to lacking the shield of faith nearly so strongly as that in religious-focused groups.		Its probable that, given the massive proliferation of Chaos-lite cults throughout the galaxy after the Age of Strife, from tribal practices that wouldn't be out of place in [[Norsca]] to [[Colchis\|complete theocracies]], the Emperor didn't want to take any chances and just banned any religious practices regardless of whether or not they were more or less obviously connected to Chaos. Even in the 40th millennium, part of their modus operandi still involves infiltrating and corrupting otherwise legitimate religious and philosophical institutions, after all. However, that is only due to how common they are. Secular organizations are just as vulnerable. More so, even, due to lacking the shield of faith nearly so strongly as that in religious-focused groups.

← Older revision		Revision as of 07:28, 25 September 2022
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	The Imperial Truth is the atheist rationalist doctrine espoused by the [[God-Emperor of Mankind\|Emperor of Mankind]] as part of the [[Great Crusade]]. According to the Imperial Truth, the Emperor believed that religion and superstition had divided mankind too much during its history. On one hand, the Emperor had reason to believe since he'd lived through most of [[Earth\|Terra]]'s religious wars (although his statements about them in The Last Church implies he either actually didn't bother knowing anything about them or he was purposefully lying to try and win an argument, both sound like him). On the other hand, these were motivated by secular reasons, defensive responses or fanatics who would have simply attached their obsession to something else if they had no religion at the time. Thus did the Emperor [[The Last Church\|become an extreme militant atheist who violently purged the religions of Terra]]. His plan was for [[Imperium of Man]] to become a secular state [[Star Trek\|espousing science and reason]] (based on the Emperor's conjectures linking religious worship to the powers of Chaos, as seen below). Although, the science and reason thing didn't shake the religious trappings and presence (such as angelic figures, daemons, and various vernacular and art quirks of the Imperium).		The Imperial Truth is the atheist rationalist doctrine espoused by the [[God-Emperor of Mankind\|Emperor of Mankind]] as part of the [[Great Crusade]]. According to the Imperial Truth, the Emperor believed that religion and superstition had divided mankind too much during its history. On one hand, the Emperor had reason to believe since he'd lived through most of [[Earth\|Terra]]'s religious wars (although his statements about them in The Last Church implies he either actually didn't bother knowing anything about them or he was purposefully lying to try and win an argument, both sound like him). On the other hand, these were motivated by secular reasons, defensive responses or fanatics who would have simply attached their obsession to something else if they had no religion at the time. Thus did the Emperor [[The Last Church\|become an extreme militant atheist who violently purged the religions of Terra]]. His plan was for [[Imperium of Man]] to become a secular state [[Star Trek\|espousing science and reason]] (based on the Emperor's conjectures linking religious worship to the powers of Chaos, as seen below). Although, the science and reason thing didn't shake the religious trappings and presence (such as angelic figures, daemons, and various vernacular and art quirks of the Imperium).

	Unsurprising; it's easy to convince someone that there is no buff guy in the sky throwing lightning bolts when you can prove it, but when confronted with something like "everything exist because God says so, the end" you can't really disprove it since anything you use was "created by God" or religions focused on an afterlife because A) can't be dis-proven even in 40K and B) souls actually ''do'' go to ''the other side of the Warp'' assuming nothing catches them and so that would actually ''encourage'' afterlife religious belief. Following the [[Horus Heresy]] and the Emperor's internment on the Golden Throne, the Imperial Truth collapsed, the Emperor's very own philosophy denounced as [[HERESY]] wherever it was not simply forgotten, and the Imperium of Man has become [[Grimdark\|a theocratic dictatorship where questioning anything results in a painful death]]. So, ~~'''~~exactly what the Emperor wanted just with worship instead of atheism as its official religious belief.~~'''~~		Unsurprising; it's easy to convince someone that there is no buff guy in the sky throwing lightning bolts when you can prove it, but when confronted with something like "everything exist because God says so, the end" you can't really disprove it since anything you use was "created by God" or religions focused on an afterlife because A) can't be dis-proven even in 40K and B) souls actually ''do'' go to ''the other side of the Warp'' assuming nothing catches them and so that would actually ''encourage'' afterlife religious belief. Following the [[Horus Heresy]] and the Emperor's internment on the Golden Throne, the Imperial Truth collapsed, the Emperor's very own philosophy denounced as [[HERESY]] wherever it was not simply forgotten, and the Imperium of Man has become [[Grimdark\|a theocratic dictatorship where questioning anything results in a painful death]]. So, exactly what the Emperor wanted just with worship instead of atheism as its official religious belief.

	Its probable that, given the massive proliferation of Chaos-lite cults throughout the galaxy after the Age of Strife, from tribal practices that wouldn't be out of place in [[Norsca]] to [[Colchis\|complete theocracies]], the Emperor didn't want to take any chances and just banned any religious practices regardless of whether or not they were more or less obviously connected to Chaos. Even in the 40th millennium, part of their modus operandi still involves infiltrating and corrupting otherwise legitimate religious and philosophical institutions, after all. However, that is only due to how common they are. Secular organizations are just as vulnerable. More so, even, due to lacking the shield of faith nearly so strongly as that in religious-focused groups.		Its probable that, given the massive proliferation of Chaos-lite cults throughout the galaxy after the Age of Strife, from tribal practices that wouldn't be out of place in [[Norsca]] to [[Colchis\|complete theocracies]], the Emperor didn't want to take any chances and just banned any religious practices regardless of whether or not they were more or less obviously connected to Chaos. Even in the 40th millennium, part of their modus operandi still involves infiltrating and corrupting otherwise legitimate religious and philosophical institutions, after all. However, that is only due to how common they are. Secular organizations are just as vulnerable. More so, even, due to lacking the shield of faith nearly so strongly as that in religious-focused groups.