Lightsaber - Revision history

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2023-06-21T16:57:47Z

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2023-06-07T16:42:34Z

1d4chan>Redvsdead: /* Lightsaber Styles */

2023-05-22T02:04:12Z

Lightsaber Styles

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:04, 22 May 2023
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	*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.		*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.
	**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have a rule softening a few of Form IV's flaws.		**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have a rule softening a few of Form IV's flaws.
	*'''Form V - Shien:''' As with Ataru, the developers of Shien looked at Form III and said that being passive was a poor form of offense. But rather than overwhelming an opponent with relentless attack as with Form IV, the Shien style maintained its emphasis on defense but taught how to redirect an opponent's strikes, moving around the battlefield and creating their own opportunities for counterattack. It is considered to be one of the better styles for combat against ranged opponents and multiple attackers, but is less suited as a dueling style (because it requires superior strength, see below).　~~Its~~ name is Japanese for "support", which is fitting for a non-offensive style. Ahsoka Tano and Galen Marek use Shien while using their lightsabers in a reverse-grip.		*'''Form V - Shien:''' As with Ataru, the developers of Shien looked at Form III and said that being passive was a poor form of offense. But rather than overwhelming an opponent with relentless attack as with Form IV, the Shien style maintained its emphasis on defense but taught how to redirect an opponent's strikes, moving around the battlefield and creating their own opportunities for counterattack. It is considered to be one of the better styles for combat against ranged opponents and multiple attackers, but is less suited as a dueling style (because it requires superior strength, see below). Its name is Japanese for "support", which is fitting for a non-offensive style. Ahsoka Tano and Galen Marek use Shien while using their lightsabers in a reverse-grip.
	**'''Djem So:''' The more physically demanding variant of Form V, the style is still grounded in the same principles of controlling your opponent and creating opportunities for counter attack, but is more suited for fighting against a single opponent as it instructs the user to physically dominate the fight by battering their way through the guard of the opponent, or opening the opponent's attacks into new opportunities to strike. As a true evolution of lightsaber-on-lightsaber combat; a Djem So practitioner ''with sufficient strength'' could overcome a skilled Makashi duelist. The specific failings of Djem So are that it is criticized for having a lack of mobility (powerful strikes require a firm footing), and is less useful for physically weak practitioners. Anakin Skywalker, learning his lesson of not recklessly charging a master of the dueling form (that is, Dooku) after losing an arm, primarily uses Djem So during the Clone Wars and episode 3. As Darth Vader, he uses a mix of Djem So, Soresu, and Makashi. The close of Anakin's fight with Bariss in Clone Wars is Djem So at its finest.		**'''Djem So:''' The more physically demanding variant of Form V, the style is still grounded in the same principles of controlling your opponent and creating opportunities for counter attack, but is more suited for fighting against a single opponent as it instructs the user to physically dominate the fight by battering their way through the guard of the opponent, or opening the opponent's attacks into new opportunities to strike. As a true evolution of lightsaber-on-lightsaber combat; a Djem So practitioner ''with sufficient strength'' could overcome a skilled Makashi duelist. The specific failings of Djem So are that it is criticized for having a lack of mobility (powerful strikes require a firm footing), and is less useful for physically weak practitioners. Anakin Skywalker, learning his lesson of not recklessly charging a master of the dueling form (that is, Dooku) after losing an arm, primarily uses Djem So during the Clone Wars and episode 3. As Darth Vader, he uses a mix of Djem So, Soresu, and Makashi. The close of Anakin's fight with Bariss in Clone Wars is Djem So at its finest.
	*'''Form VI - Niman:''' The "Moderate" form that combined elements from all of the previous forms into a single hybrid style, allowing its practitioners to learn the basics of lightsaber combat in all areas, eventually replacing Form I as the ''"standard"'' style by the time of the Clone Wars. Critics point out that this form is insufficiently demanding, provides no decisive edge in battle, and is ill-suited to both dueling and the open battlefield. However, Form VI does encourage its adherents to be highly flexible and to incorporate more Force techniques in combat, encouraging the user to strike and guard telekinetically and control the fight intuitively. This made ultimate mastery of the Niman style very difficult, so as with Form I, most initiates eventually gravitated towards a different style to suit their preferences. However, true masters of the art, like Exar Kun (who is pretty much unmatched in melee except by freakishly powerful beings like Vitiate and Luke) are incomparable in combat, having no weakness in form to exploit, closing the advantage gap by sheer skill.		*'''Form VI - Niman:''' The "Moderate" form that combined elements from all of the previous forms into a single hybrid style, allowing its practitioners to learn the basics of lightsaber combat in all areas, eventually replacing Form I as the ''"standard"'' style by the time of the Clone Wars. Critics point out that this form is insufficiently demanding, provides no decisive edge in battle, and is ill-suited to both dueling and the open battlefield. However, Form VI does encourage its adherents to be highly flexible and to incorporate more Force techniques in combat, encouraging the user to strike and guard telekinetically and control the fight intuitively. This made ultimate mastery of the Niman style very difficult, so as with Form I, most initiates eventually gravitated towards a different style to suit their preferences. However, true masters of the art, like Exar Kun (who is pretty much unmatched in melee except by freakishly powerful beings like Vitiate and Luke) are incomparable in combat, having no weakness in form to exploit, closing the advantage gap by sheer skill.

107.126.28.25: /* Lightsaber Styles */

2023-05-20T19:34:56Z

Lightsaber Styles

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:34, 20 May 2023
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	*'''Form II - Makashi:''' If Form I is "sword fighting," then Form II is "fencing." It uses a more precise and elegant method of attack and defense versus the sweeping movements of Form I, though still operating on traditional "sword form" techniques. Makashi is a style best suited for one-on-one combat, though as with Form I it offers no defense against ranged weapons. Its name is Japanese for "to defeat." Count Dooku's style.		*'''Form II - Makashi:''' If Form I is "sword fighting," then Form II is "fencing." It uses a more precise and elegant method of attack and defense versus the sweeping movements of Form I, though still operating on traditional "sword form" techniques. Makashi is a style best suited for one-on-one combat, though as with Form I it offers no defense against ranged weapons. Its name is Japanese for "to defeat." Count Dooku's style.
	** The story goes that late Christopher Lee, given his background in fencing, refused to use the lightsaber as a broadsword instead wanting to show off his world champion fencing ability so they altered his style. Thus the movie version incorporates Christopher Lee's fencing experience.		** The story goes that late Christopher Lee, given his background in fencing, refused to use the lightsaber as a broadsword instead wanting to show off his world champion fencing ability so they altered his style. Thus the movie version incorporates Christopher Lee's fencing experience.
	*'''Form III - Soresu:''' Someone somewhere noted that the first two forms were useless against ranged weapons and moved to correct this, creating an all-new style that catered to defense and was the first style to truly teach how to block blaster bolts. In melee combat it placed emphasis on small, efficient movements, outlasting your opponent(s), and waiting for them to tire and/or make a mistake. Its inoffensive nature marked it as the ultimate expression of the Jedi philosophy but meant that inexperienced initiates were left without effective means of attack. Obi Wan took up this style after Qui-Gonn's death and is considered THE master of Soresu.		*'''Form III - Soresu:''' Someone somewhere noted that the first two forms were useless against ranged weapons and moved to correct this, creating an all-new style that catered to defense and was the first style to truly teach how to block blaster bolts. In melee combat it placed emphasis on small, efficient movements, outlasting your opponent(s), and waiting for them to tire and/or make a mistake. Its inoffensive nature marked it as the ultimate expression of the Jedi philosophy but meant that inexperienced initiates were left without effective means of attack. Obi Wan took up this style after Qui-Gonn's death and is considered THE master of Soresu. Maul also adopted a Soresu stance ''immediately'' when confronted by Sidious on Mandalore, notable for being the only time he has ''ever'' used Form III. In Maul's case, it serves as an example of just how scared of Sidious Maul was, that he was on the defensive right from the start.
	*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.		*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.
	**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have a rule softening a few of Form IV's flaws.		**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have a rule softening a few of Form IV's flaws.

1d4chan>Super12345: /* Influences on the rest of /tg/ culture */

2023-05-20T16:26:07Z

Influences on the rest of /tg/ culture

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:26, 20 May 2023
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	* Sun Blade: A magic item from Dungeons and Dragons that is a sword hilt that generates a blade of energy that does radiant damage.		* Sun Blade: A magic item from Dungeons and Dragons that is a sword hilt that generates a blade of energy that does radiant damage.
	* Beam melee weapons: From the long running franchise Mobile Suit Gundam. In-universe, the first Mobile Suit (the name used in the series for the giant robots) armed with a beam melee weapon is the titular Gundam RX-78. It carried two beam sabers in its backpack, which also served to recharge them when not in use. It could also be armed with a beam javelin (a long rod that emitted a larger, spiked beam and was suited for throwing). In-universe this was a game-changer: other MS were armed with heat weapons (i.e. melee weapons with super-heated edges for better cutting through armour) which could be pretty bulky with an exposed power source. Beam weapons were lightweight, compact when inactive and they could cut through just about any type of armour around. Mass-producing beam weapons (and mobile suits to wield them) was one of the major turning points of the war in the original series but the vast majority of the time the original anime shows them used pretty much exclusively for destroying battleships, with only a single beam duel that's cut in the movie version. Later series got really crazy, with beam scimitars, beam daggers, beam whips, beam fans...yeah, shit goes crazy over at [[/m/]].		* Beam melee weapons: From the long running franchise Mobile Suit Gundam. In-universe, the first Mobile Suit (the name used in the series for the giant robots) armed with a beam melee weapon is the titular Gundam RX-78. It carried two beam sabers in its backpack, which also served to recharge them when not in use. It could also be armed with a beam javelin (a long rod that emitted a larger, spiked beam and was suited for throwing). In-universe this was a game-changer: other MS were armed with heat weapons (i.e. melee weapons with super-heated edges for better cutting through armour) which could be pretty bulky with an exposed power source. Beam weapons were lightweight, compact when inactive and they could cut through just about any type of armour around. Mass-producing beam weapons (and mobile suits to wield them) was one of the major turning points of the war in the original series but the vast majority of the time the original anime shows them used pretty much exclusively for destroying battleships, with only a single beam duel that's cut in the movie version. Later series got really crazy, with beam scimitars, beam daggers, beam whips, beam fans...yeah, shit goes crazy over at [[/m/]].
			** It should be mentioned that different Gundam timelines have different behaving beam weapons due to different physics. In Universal Century, they're Minovski Particles contained in an I-field in a plasma-like way. Heat weapons are effectively a predecessor or more primitive version up to and including the ability to clash. Minovksi Particles and I-fields don't exist in many other timelines therefore they substitute with whatever generic charged particles or plot pixie dust the setting has. This includes many instances where one timeline has beam sabers clash each other, another has them unable to clash, etc.

	[[Category: Star Wars]][[Category: Weapons]]		[[Category: Star Wars]][[Category: Weapons]]

72.229.242.36: /* Issues with Lightsabers */ It is true: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ad9n9qWkVxo

2023-05-20T16:19:41Z

Issues with Lightsabers: It is true: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ad9n9qWkVxo

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:19, 20 May 2023
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	One of the biggest issues with lightsabers is shown in the side material of Star Wars itself. They block most energy blots well enough. Assassins who specialize in killing Jedi use slug throwers to bypass their ability to block blaster bolts. So when the users tries to deflect bullets, a Jedi instead has to deal with very hot goo coming at them at hypersonic speeds. So Railguns and Gauss weapons would easily defeat them.		One of the biggest issues with lightsabers is shown in the side material of Star Wars itself. They block most energy blots well enough. Assassins who specialize in killing Jedi use slug throwers to bypass their ability to block blaster bolts. So when the users tries to deflect bullets, a Jedi instead has to deal with very hot goo coming at them at hypersonic speeds. So Railguns and Gauss weapons would easily defeat them.
	*[[Skub\|Depending on who's the writer]], some can even block slug throwers and the lightsaber vaporizes the bullet. Begs the question why bother blocking if they have the reflexes to measure a bullet's path and smack it when you're a telekinetic space wizard who could theoretically poll a [[/tv/\|Neo]]. Kylo Ren froze a blaster shot. Surely that's doable with smaller munitions.		*[[Skub\|Depending on who's the writer]], some can even block slug throwers and the lightsaber vaporizes the bullet. Begs the question why bother blocking if they have the reflexes to measure a bullet's path and smack it when you're a telekinetic space wizard who could theoretically poll a [[/tv/\|Neo]]. Kylo Ren froze a blaster shot, not to mention Darth Vader blocked multiple blaster shots with his hand in Empire Strikes Back. Surely that's doable with smaller munitions.

	Star Wars writers also ignored most energy weapons would have larger bore sizes or a higher rate of fire than a blaster. As blocking them would just cause thousands of micro-explosions that sets it's victim alight with plasma while knocking them flat on their asses or into the nearest solid object. IRL a plasma bolt travels at nearly 3000 times the speed of sound. Way faster than those fired from Blasters. A proper laser firearm (or those firing exotic particles that move at speeds faster than light) would make short work of most Sith and Jedi. In theory this is mostly why only force users get away with light sabers as there able to preemptively move to deflect a bolt but even so this has limits and fire enough fast enough projectiles will ensure they get by something. Which is the only reason lasers are only used on vehicles and other energy weapons barley show up at all.		Star Wars writers also ignored most energy weapons would have larger bore sizes or a higher rate of fire than a blaster. As blocking them would just cause thousands of micro-explosions that sets it's victim alight with plasma while knocking them flat on their asses or into the nearest solid object. IRL a plasma bolt travels at nearly 3000 times the speed of sound. Way faster than those fired from Blasters. A proper laser firearm (or those firing exotic particles that move at speeds faster than light) would make short work of most Sith and Jedi. In theory this is mostly why only force users get away with light sabers as there able to preemptively move to deflect a bolt but even so this has limits and fire enough fast enough projectiles will ensure they get by something. Which is the only reason lasers are only used on vehicles and other energy weapons barley show up at all.

1d4chan>Super12345: /* Issues with Lightsabers */

2023-05-20T16:18:48Z

Issues with Lightsabers

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:18, 20 May 2023
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	Another point is the double lightsaber. Based on a variety of unbladed [[pole-arm]]s like the Gun or the Bo, it has a double-sized handle with the laser parts coming out from both ends. The problem with this style is that it gives the wielder only a limited surface to work with without burning or chopping their hands off. Maybe this can be discredited as training in the Force and all that jazz (plus Ray Park, the actor and stunt performer for Darth Maul, is REALLY good at what he does, in fact it was his input that resulted in the double lightsaber's handle being the length it is, since the original concept had a much shorter one), but this would still involve swinging a large dangerous rave stick very close to your body, and a good number of these styles involve holding the weapon near the end to gain great striking power at the tip of the weapon like with a [[pole-arm]]. With a lightsaber this is not possible, though not needed since it can just cut through anything by touching a target and letting the plasma do all the work.		Another point is the double lightsaber. Based on a variety of unbladed [[pole-arm]]s like the Gun or the Bo, it has a double-sized handle with the laser parts coming out from both ends. The problem with this style is that it gives the wielder only a limited surface to work with without burning or chopping their hands off. Maybe this can be discredited as training in the Force and all that jazz (plus Ray Park, the actor and stunt performer for Darth Maul, is REALLY good at what he does, in fact it was his input that resulted in the double lightsaber's handle being the length it is, since the original concept had a much shorter one), but this would still involve swinging a large dangerous rave stick very close to your body, and a good number of these styles involve holding the weapon near the end to gain great striking power at the tip of the weapon like with a [[pole-arm]]. With a lightsaber this is not possible, though not needed since it can just cut through anything by touching a target and letting the plasma do all the work.
	*It should be mentioned that lacking mass and easily used in single form, a double lightsaber would be more practical than many other fictional double sword designs. Nothing forces you to use both sides. Maul used it exclusively in single form when he ambushed Qui-Gonn on Tatooine. Used in single form, Maul's double lightsaber would be a regular lightsaber with a longer grip and hilt. Maul first used both blades in a 2vs1 on Naboo where he had to counter multiple lightsabers coming at him at the same time. Edge alignment is also a non-factor with a lightsaber so you only need to worry about the blade hitting, not how. This means moves that would smack a blunt back or flat in other double bladed swords would work here. Still constant risk of hitting yourself though.		*It should be mentioned that lacking mass and easily used in single form, a double lightsaber would be more practical than many other fictional double sword designs. Nothing forces you to use both sides. Maul used it exclusively in single form when he ambushed Qui-Gonn on Tatooine. Used in single form, Maul's double lightsaber would be a regular lightsaber with a longer grip and hilt. Maul first used both blades in a 2vs1 on Naboo where he had to counter multiple lightsabers coming at him at the same time. Edge alignment is also a non-factor with a lightsaber so you only need to worry about the blade hitting, not how. This means moves that would smack a blunt back or flat in other double bladed swords would work here. Still constant risk of hitting yourself though.
			*Another [[awesome]] use [[Derp\|rarely seen]] with lightsabers in general is strategically turning blades on and off during a fight but especially prevalent in double lightsabers. Exar Kun was said to have done this in a guide but [[derp\|you'll have a hard time finding actual scenes where he does]]. Kao Cen Darach from Old Republic's Return Trailer has demonstrated the effectiveness of this tactic however. It's doable given enough skill.

	And the lightwhip and all other kinds of outlandish lightsabers can go right fuck themselves. And don't use the Force argument; if someone focuses on holding a plasma whip properly they will get shot because, super powerful or not, you still have to think. The "lightcrossguard" on the lightsaber of Kylo Ren certainly looked silly, but for one, they gave him an edge in close combat letting him use them to burn his opponent in a bind, and secondly, expanded material say they are vents required because his lightsaber is unstable. You'd think that his boss might fix that problem for him, but that would be using logic.		And the lightwhip and all other kinds of outlandish lightsabers can go right fuck themselves. And don't use the Force argument; if someone focuses on holding a plasma whip properly they will get shot because, super powerful or not, you still have to think. The "lightcrossguard" on the lightsaber of Kylo Ren certainly looked silly, but for one, they gave him an edge in close combat letting him use them to burn his opponent in a bind, and secondly, expanded material say they are vents required because his lightsaber is unstable. You'd think that his boss might fix that problem for him, but that would be using logic.

1d4chan>Super12345: /* Issues with Lightsabers */

2023-05-20T16:12:56Z

Issues with Lightsabers

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:12, 20 May 2023
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	Another point is the double lightsaber. Based on a variety of unbladed [[pole-arm]]s like the Gun or the Bo, it has a double-sized handle with the laser parts coming out from both ends. The problem with this style is that it gives the wielder only a limited surface to work with without burning or chopping their hands off. Maybe this can be discredited as training in the Force and all that jazz (plus Ray Park, the actor and stunt performer for Darth Maul, is REALLY good at what he does, in fact it was his input that resulted in the double lightsaber's handle being the length it is, since the original concept had a much shorter one), but this would still involve swinging a large dangerous rave stick very close to your body, and a good number of these styles involve holding the weapon near the end to gain great striking power at the tip of the weapon like with a [[pole-arm]]. With a lightsaber this is not possible, though not needed since it can just cut through anything by touching a target and letting the plasma do all the work.		Another point is the double lightsaber. Based on a variety of unbladed [[pole-arm]]s like the Gun or the Bo, it has a double-sized handle with the laser parts coming out from both ends. The problem with this style is that it gives the wielder only a limited surface to work with without burning or chopping their hands off. Maybe this can be discredited as training in the Force and all that jazz (plus Ray Park, the actor and stunt performer for Darth Maul, is REALLY good at what he does, in fact it was his input that resulted in the double lightsaber's handle being the length it is, since the original concept had a much shorter one), but this would still involve swinging a large dangerous rave stick very close to your body, and a good number of these styles involve holding the weapon near the end to gain great striking power at the tip of the weapon like with a [[pole-arm]]. With a lightsaber this is not possible, though not needed since it can just cut through anything by touching a target and letting the plasma do all the work.
			*It should be mentioned that lacking mass and easily used in single form, a double lightsaber would be more practical than many other fictional double sword designs. Nothing forces you to use both sides. Maul used it exclusively in single form when he ambushed Qui-Gonn on Tatooine. Used in single form, Maul's double lightsaber would be a regular lightsaber with a longer grip and hilt. Maul first used both blades in a 2vs1 on Naboo where he had to counter multiple lightsabers coming at him at the same time. Edge alignment is also a non-factor with a lightsaber so you only need to worry about the blade hitting, not how. This means moves that would smack a blunt back or flat in other double bladed swords would work here. Still constant risk of hitting yourself though.

	And the lightwhip and all other kinds of outlandish lightsabers can go right fuck themselves. And don't use the Force argument; if someone focuses on holding a plasma whip properly they will get shot because, super powerful or not, you still have to think. The "lightcrossguard" on the lightsaber of Kylo Ren certainly looked silly, but for one, they gave him an edge in close combat letting him use them to burn his opponent in a bind, and secondly, expanded material say they are vents required because his lightsaber is unstable. You'd think that his boss might fix that problem for him, but that would be using logic.		And the lightwhip and all other kinds of outlandish lightsabers can go right fuck themselves. And don't use the Force argument; if someone focuses on holding a plasma whip properly they will get shot because, super powerful or not, you still have to think. The "lightcrossguard" on the lightsaber of Kylo Ren certainly looked silly, but for one, they gave him an edge in close combat letting him use them to burn his opponent in a bind, and secondly, expanded material say they are vents required because his lightsaber is unstable. You'd think that his boss might fix that problem for him, but that would be using logic.

	One of the biggest issues with lightsabers is shown in the side material of Star Wars itself. They block most energy blots well enough. Assassins who specialize in killing Jedi use slug throwers to bypass their ability to block blaster bolts. So when the users tries to deflect bullets, a Jedi instead has to deal with very hot goo coming at them at hypersonic speeds. So Railguns and Gauss weapons would easily defeat them.		One of the biggest issues with lightsabers is shown in the side material of Star Wars itself. They block most energy blots well enough. Assassins who specialize in killing Jedi use slug throwers to bypass their ability to block blaster bolts. So when the users tries to deflect bullets, a Jedi instead has to deal with very hot goo coming at them at hypersonic speeds. So Railguns and Gauss weapons would easily defeat them.
			*[[Skub\|Depending on who's the writer]], some can even block slug throwers and the lightsaber vaporizes the bullet. Begs the question why bother blocking if they have the reflexes to measure a bullet's path and smack it when you're a telekinetic space wizard who could theoretically poll a [[/tv/\|Neo]]. Kylo Ren froze a blaster shot. Surely that's doable with smaller munitions.

	Star Wars writers also ignored most energy weapons would have larger bore sizes or a higher rate of fire than a blaster. As blocking them would just cause thousands of micro-explosions that sets it's victim alight with plasma while knocking them flat on their asses or into the nearest solid object. IRL a plasma bolt travels at nearly 3000 times the speed of sound. Way faster than those fired from Blasters. A proper laser firearm (or those firing exotic particles that move at speeds faster than light) would make short work of most Sith and Jedi. In theory this is mostly why only force users get away with light sabers as there able to preemptively move to deflect a bolt but even so this has limits and fire enough fast enough projectiles will ensure they get by something. Which is the only reason lasers are only used on vehicles and other energy weapons barley show up at all.		Star Wars writers also ignored most energy weapons would have larger bore sizes or a higher rate of fire than a blaster. As blocking them would just cause thousands of micro-explosions that sets it's victim alight with plasma while knocking them flat on their asses or into the nearest solid object. IRL a plasma bolt travels at nearly 3000 times the speed of sound. Way faster than those fired from Blasters. A proper laser firearm (or those firing exotic particles that move at speeds faster than light) would make short work of most Sith and Jedi. In theory this is mostly why only force users get away with light sabers as there able to preemptively move to deflect a bolt but even so this has limits and fire enough fast enough projectiles will ensure they get by something. Which is the only reason lasers are only used on vehicles and other energy weapons barley show up at all.

1d4chan>Super12345: /* Lightsaber Styles */

2023-05-20T15:49:20Z

Lightsaber Styles

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:49, 20 May 2023
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	*'''Form III - Soresu:''' Someone somewhere noted that the first two forms were useless against ranged weapons and moved to correct this, creating an all-new style that catered to defense and was the first style to truly teach how to block blaster bolts. In melee combat it placed emphasis on small, efficient movements, outlasting your opponent(s), and waiting for them to tire and/or make a mistake. Its inoffensive nature marked it as the ultimate expression of the Jedi philosophy but meant that inexperienced initiates were left without effective means of attack. Obi Wan took up this style after Qui-Gonn's death and is considered THE master of Soresu.		*'''Form III - Soresu:''' Someone somewhere noted that the first two forms were useless against ranged weapons and moved to correct this, creating an all-new style that catered to defense and was the first style to truly teach how to block blaster bolts. In melee combat it placed emphasis on small, efficient movements, outlasting your opponent(s), and waiting for them to tire and/or make a mistake. Its inoffensive nature marked it as the ultimate expression of the Jedi philosophy but meant that inexperienced initiates were left without effective means of attack. Obi Wan took up this style after Qui-Gonn's death and is considered THE master of Soresu.
	*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.		*'''Form IV - Ataru:''' Forms IV and V were developed concurrently, as lightsaber masters looked at Form III and decided it was far too passive a combat form, as simply waiting for your enemy to tire out isn't really an effective means of fighting. "Ataru" therefore was developed as an "aggressive" form that placed emphasis on overwhelming attack; teaching its practitioners to strike relentlessly and acrobatically from multiple angles, requiring high agility and endurance on the part of its users. The main problems with Ataru are that it is not suitable for long encounters, or for closed environments. Also, its emphasis on acrobatics means its strikes often lack power, and thus are easy to parry by another lightsaber, especially if the defender is on firm footing or physically stronger than the attacker. Its name is Japanese for "to hit." Yoda uses Ataru exclusively, as does Anakin Skywalker in episode 2.
	**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have ~~some~~ rule softening of Form IV's ~~requirements or~~ flaws.		**It should be noted that Yoda's small size helps do away with many of its downsides. He's smaller and thus he's a more difficult target to hit during acrobatics. Not even Dooku or Sidious could hit him with a lightsaber. He's lighter thus jumping and movement requires less physical energy than a heavier user and can last longer. His weapon's shorter and therefore easier to manage in closed environments. Thus even without Yoda's considerably far above average experience and Force skill, he's a perfect fit. If one were to stat Yoda, he'd have a rule softening a few of Form IV's flaws.
	*'''Form V - Shien:''' As with Ataru, the developers of Shien looked at Form III and said that being passive was a poor form of offense. But rather than overwhelming an opponent with relentless attack as with Form IV, the Shien style maintained its emphasis on defense but taught how to redirect an opponent's strikes, moving around the battlefield and creating their own opportunities for counterattack. It is considered to be one of the better styles for combat against ranged opponents and multiple attackers, but is less suited as a dueling style (because it requires superior strength, see below).　Its name is Japanese for "support", which is fitting for a non-offensive style. Ahsoka Tano and Galen Marek use Shien while using their lightsabers in a reverse-grip.		*'''Form V - Shien:''' As with Ataru, the developers of Shien looked at Form III and said that being passive was a poor form of offense. But rather than overwhelming an opponent with relentless attack as with Form IV, the Shien style maintained its emphasis on defense but taught how to redirect an opponent's strikes, moving around the battlefield and creating their own opportunities for counterattack. It is considered to be one of the better styles for combat against ranged opponents and multiple attackers, but is less suited as a dueling style (because it requires superior strength, see below).　Its name is Japanese for "support", which is fitting for a non-offensive style. Ahsoka Tano and Galen Marek use Shien while using their lightsabers in a reverse-grip.
	**'''Djem So:''' The more physically demanding variant of Form V, the style is still grounded in the same principles of controlling your opponent and creating opportunities for counter attack, but is more suited for fighting against a single opponent as it instructs the user to physically dominate the fight by battering their way through the guard of the opponent, or opening the opponent's attacks into new opportunities to strike. As a true evolution of lightsaber-on-lightsaber combat; a Djem So practitioner ''with sufficient strength'' could overcome a skilled Makashi duelist. The specific failings of Djem So are that it is criticized for having a lack of mobility (powerful strikes require a firm footing), and is less useful for physically weak practitioners. Anakin Skywalker, learning his lesson of not recklessly charging a master of the dueling form (that is, Dooku) after losing an arm, primarily uses Djem So during the Clone Wars and episode 3. As Darth Vader, he uses a mix of Djem So, Soresu, and Makashi. The close of Anakin's fight with Bariss in Clone Wars is Djem So at its finest.		**'''Djem So:''' The more physically demanding variant of Form V, the style is still grounded in the same principles of controlling your opponent and creating opportunities for counter attack, but is more suited for fighting against a single opponent as it instructs the user to physically dominate the fight by battering their way through the guard of the opponent, or opening the opponent's attacks into new opportunities to strike. As a true evolution of lightsaber-on-lightsaber combat; a Djem So practitioner ''with sufficient strength'' could overcome a skilled Makashi duelist. The specific failings of Djem So are that it is criticized for having a lack of mobility (powerful strikes require a firm footing), and is less useful for physically weak practitioners. Anakin Skywalker, learning his lesson of not recklessly charging a master of the dueling form (that is, Dooku) after losing an arm, primarily uses Djem So during the Clone Wars and episode 3. As Darth Vader, he uses a mix of Djem So, Soresu, and Makashi. The close of Anakin's fight with Bariss in Clone Wars is Djem So at its finest.