Talk:D20 Modern - Revision history

Sdhjk at 12:43, 10 August 2025

2025-08-10T12:43:48Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:43, 10 August 2025
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	Besides: PL4 is guns, from flintlocks and percussion cap firearms, to unitary cartridge firearms. Modern guns we use today are closer to PL4 Cold War guns, than to PL6 laser guns; so they're PL4 - and the PL5 things are the "overcomplicated prototype" gun kinds. --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:20, 30 July 2025 (UTC)		Besides: PL4 is guns, from flintlocks and percussion cap firearms, to unitary cartridge firearms. Modern guns we use today are closer to PL4 Cold War guns, than to PL6 laser guns; so they're PL4 - and the PL5 things are the "overcomplicated prototype" gun kinds. --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:20, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

			== Jumping to Epic-equivalent levels ==
			Basically, something like this: Character is basic android of level 20. Then he loads his mind into some building-sized scary armed machine. ECL skyrockets, but there's just no enemies worthy of such level, so ECL ends up being meaningless. Though, this requires GM's discretion and androids in game are underpowered, so not worth it. --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 12:43, 10 August 2025 (UTC)

Sdhjk: /* When PL4 ends and PL5 starts */

2025-07-30T16:20:21Z

When PL4 ends and PL5 starts

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:20, 30 July 2025
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	Have any objections? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 15:58, 30 July 2025 (UTC)		Have any objections? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 15:58, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

			Besides: PL4 is guns, from flintlocks and percussion cap firearms, to unitary cartridge firearms. Modern guns we use today are closer to PL4 Cold War guns, than to PL6 laser guns; so they're PL4 - and the PL5 things are the "overcomplicated prototype" gun kinds. --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:20, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

Sdhjk at 15:58, 30 July 2025

2025-07-30T15:58:28Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:58, 30 July 2025
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	** More ammo yet Licensed? Winchester 1873 (PL 4) and "Tikka Model 65 Master" ("Modern Playaids: Sniper") may be used. Former has 2d10 and more shots, latter has more range.		** More ammo yet Licensed? Winchester 1873 (PL 4) and "Tikka Model 65 Master" ("Modern Playaids: Sniper") may be used. Former has 2d10 and more shots, latter has more range.
	Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])		Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])

			== When PL4 ends and PL5 starts ==
			It's hard to determine, but i could try anyways. An unreliable source claimed that it's 1950 - [[Fail\|but it contradicted itself, as it claimed that lever-action rifles and percussion-cap guns were PL5]]. So i need my own calculation.

			Games states that PL4 key technologies are:
			# hydraulic, steam, electric power
			# telegraph, telephone, radio
			# heavy ironclad vessels, rail transportation, architecture of previously unimagined size, urbanization
			# aircraft and submarines, for exploration and war
			# reliable and accurate rifles, pistols, machine guns, mechanized war machines
			# psychology, evolutionary biology, genetics
			# "weapons of mass destruction and the means to transport those weapons on a global scale"; fission power and weapons

			Game states that key PL5 technologies, which aren't present on PL4 (e.g. corporations and military alliances were since PL3), are:
			# computer technology and electronics
			# satellite information systems, the Internet
			# crude space travel
			# computerized targeting systems and guided weapons
			# weapons are slightly upgraded versions of PL4 weaponry

			As such, the likely point of change, is when computers turn from slow room-sized contraptions into fast pocket devices. That is - roughly 1990's to 2000's. All weapons from Industrial Revolution and before that point are 100% PL4.

			Now, most modern weapons use same key technologies as those of Cold War. Tactical accessories, plastic parts, automatic weapons, extended magazines, laser sights, fancy non-computer sights (collimators, optics, etc) - all that is technically doable in Cold War. As such, unless noted otherwise, '''''all''''' modern weapons are PL4. The only things which are ''actually'' PL5 are computerized weapons (e.g. OICW), electronics (e.g. all but the most primitive models of personal thermal vision devices, nigh vision devices, computerized sights, electronic rangefinders), most caseless ammunition weapons (e.g. G11). If gun doesn't have such advanced components, it's PL4, even if it was made in 2020's or even 2060's.

			Have any objections? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 15:58, 30 July 2025 (UTC)

Sdhjk: /* Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=) */

2025-07-29T17:04:40Z

Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=)

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:04, 29 July 2025
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	** Springfield M1903, Winchester 94. PL4. Longer-ranged, 2d10 rifles. No automatic fire. Former is magazine-fed, latter is internal magazine but a little more ammo and a little more range. Most other archaic "Past" rifles are worse than AK-47.		** Springfield M1903, Winchester 94. PL4. Longer-ranged, 2d10 rifles. No automatic fire. Former is magazine-fed, latter is internal magazine but a little more ammo and a little more range. Most other archaic "Past" rifles are worse than AK-47.
	** Repeating Shotgun. PL4. Working shotgun, but worse than AK-47. Ithaca Model 37 Series has 1 more ammo, but internal magazine - not worth it.		** Repeating Shotgun. PL4. Working shotgun, but worse than AK-47. Ithaca Model 37 Series has 1 more ammo, but internal magazine - not worth it.
			** More ammo yet Licensed? Winchester 1873 (PL 4) and "Tikka Model 65 Master" ("Modern Playaids: Sniper") may be used. Former has 2d10 and more shots, latter has more range.
	Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])		Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])

Sdhjk: /* Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=) */

2025-07-29T16:38:03Z

Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:38, 29 July 2025
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	* Pistols:		* Pistols:
	** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.		** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.
			*** Smith & Wesson 38/200 (.357) from PL4 is also practically equivalent to Ruger Service-Six.
	** Browning High Power from basic set. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.		** Browning High Power from basic set. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.
	*** Browning High Power from "Weapons Locker" has big magazine and normal range. Still PL4. Best budget small pistol in this case.		*** Browning High Power from "Weapons Locker" has big magazine and normal range. Still PL4. Best budget small pistol in this case.

Sdhjk: /* Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=) */

2025-07-29T16:32:16Z

Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:32, 29 July 2025
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	* Pistols:		* Pistols:
	** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.		** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.
	** Browning High Power. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.		** Browning High Power from basic set. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.
	*** Browning High Power from "Weapons Locker" has big magazine and normal range. Still PL4. Best budget small pistol in this case.		*** Browning High Power from "Weapons Locker" has big magazine and normal range. Still PL4. Best budget small pistol in this case.
	** Tec-9 fires semi-automatic or automatic, no fire selector. Medium. Has rather large magazine.		** Tec-9 from basic set fires semi-automatic or automatic, no fire selector. Medium. Has rather large magazine.
			*** '''Not''' Tec-9 from Weapons Locker. That has fire selector, but non-trivial cost - in which case, it loses to certain other SMG's.
	** CZ 92 and Pathfinder. Tiny, 8 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d4 damage, 20 ft range.		** CZ 92 and Pathfinder. Tiny, 8 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d4 damage, 20 ft range.
	* Longarms:		* Longarms:

Sdhjk: /* Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=) */

2025-07-29T16:30:35Z

Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=)

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:30, 29 July 2025
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	** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.		** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.
	** Browning High Power. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.		** Browning High Power. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.
			*** Browning High Power from "Weapons Locker" has big magazine and normal range. Still PL4. Best budget small pistol in this case.
	** Tec-9 fires semi-automatic or automatic, no fire selector. Medium. Has rather large magazine.		** Tec-9 fires semi-automatic or automatic, no fire selector. Medium. Has rather large magazine.
	** CZ 92 and Pathfinder. Tiny, 8 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d4 damage, 20 ft range.		** CZ 92 and Pathfinder. Tiny, 8 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d4 damage, 20 ft range.
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	** AK-47. It's actually late PL4, so PDC 13 on PL5. A good assault rifle, good for most tasks. Could be main weapon.		** AK-47. It's actually late PL4, so PDC 13 on PL5. A good assault rifle, good for most tasks. Could be main weapon.
	** Thompson M1921. PL4. Better than AK-47 for close range due to enormous magazine, but range is small.		** Thompson M1921. PL4. Better than AK-47 for close range due to enormous magazine, but range is small.
	** Springfield M1903, Winchester 94. PL4. Longer-ranged, 2d10 rifles. No automatic fire. Most other archaic "Past" rifles are worse than AK-47.		** Springfield M1903, Winchester 94. PL4. Longer-ranged, 2d10 rifles. No automatic fire. Former is magazine-fed, latter is internal magazine but a little more ammo and a little more range. Most other archaic "Past" rifles are worse than AK-47.
	** Repeating Shotgun. PL4. Working shotgun, but worse than AK-47.		** Repeating Shotgun. PL4. Working shotgun, but worse than AK-47. Ithaca Model 37 Series has 1 more ammo, but internal magazine - not worth it.
	Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])		Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])

Sdhjk at 16:04, 29 July 2025

2025-07-29T16:04:32Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:04, 29 July 2025
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	--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)		--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)

			== Budget Weapons Analysis (PDC 14 <=) ==
			* Pistols:
			** MAS M50 and Ruger Service-Six. Small, 9 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d6 damage, 30 ft range. Most revolvers are very reliable, don't misfire. Tokagypt 58 and TT33 are roughly same, except 8 ammo, and TT33 is very cheap due to PL4.
			** Browning High Power. PL 4. Larger clip, smaller range.
			** Tec-9 fires semi-automatic or automatic, no fire selector. Medium. Has rather large magazine.
			** CZ 92 and Pathfinder. Tiny, 8 and 6 bullets respectively, 2d4 damage, 20 ft range.
			* Longarms:
			** AK-47. It's actually late PL4, so PDC 13 on PL5. A good assault rifle, good for most tasks. Could be main weapon.
			** Thompson M1921. PL4. Better than AK-47 for close range due to enormous magazine, but range is small.
			** Springfield M1903, Winchester 94. PL4. Longer-ranged, 2d10 rifles. No automatic fire. Most other archaic "Past" rifles are worse than AK-47.
			** Repeating Shotgun. PL4. Working shotgun, but worse than AK-47.
			Missed anything worthwhile? --[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]])

Sdhjk: /* 20mm Light Autocannon */

2025-07-17T19:35:43Z

20mm Light Autocannon

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:35, 17 July 2025
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	Restriction: Mil (+3)		Restriction: Mil (+3)

			PL: 4 (Industrial Age)

	--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)		--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)

Sdhjk at 16:35, 17 July 2025

2025-07-17T16:35:27Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:35, 17 July 2025
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	Stats:		Stats:

	Damage: 4d8		Damage: 4d8

	Magazine: Linked		Magazine: Linked

	Critical: 20		Critical: 20

	Size: Huge		Size: Huge

	Damage Type: Ballistic		Damage Type: Ballistic

	Weight: 60 lb.		Weight: 60 lb.

	Range Increment: 120 ft.		Range Increment: 120 ft.

	Purchase DC: ??		Purchase DC: ??

	Rate of Fire: S, A		Rate of Fire: S, A

	Restriction: Mil (+3)		Restriction: Mil (+3)


	--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)		--[[User:Sdhjk\|Sdhjk]] ([[User talk:Sdhjk\|talk]]) 16:33, 17 July 2025 (UTC)