ZSU 23-4 Shilka - Revision history

imported>Administrator: 57 revisions imported

2023-06-24T02:50:29Z

57 revisions imported

← Older revision	Revision as of 02:50, 24 June 2023
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imported>Administrator: 1 revision imported

2023-06-19T15:33:59Z

1 revision imported

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1d4chan>Redvsdead: /* IRL */

2023-06-11T20:49:18Z

IRL

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:49, 11 June 2023
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	[[File:Zsu 23 4 shilka.jpg\|300px\|right\|thumb\|DAKADAKADAKADAKA ]]		[[File:Zsu 23 4 shilka.jpg\|300px\|right\|thumb\|DAKADAKADAKADAKA ]]
	The ZSU is one of the more popular armoured fighting vehicles made by the Soviet Union, traditionally armed with a quad-linked 4x23mm autocannon array, a search light, and radar equipment. Its primarily designed to shoot down low-flying aircraft like helicopters and occasional fighter craft, but its guns were also powerful enough to tear through lightly-armored vehicles and infantry aswell. Infact it was a common practice for Soviet soldiers to bring ZSUs whenever possible in anti-infantry operations due to their sheer lethality. In this regard, the ZSU found major use in the Invasion of Afghanistan, where often it would protect conveys within the hilly, mountainous terrain of the country. The Insurgents soon found out that quad 23mm cannons had much higher elevation than the weapons on the BMPs, BTRs and T-52s, allowing it to engage them from their ambush points on high ridges and hilltops. A special variant was deployed for that use in this conflict, lacking the AA radar in favour of increased ammunition capacity, turning the AA tank into a meat chopper. That said, the ZSU was never meant to be a front-line vehicle, so it's armor is woefully light, even concentrated heavy machine gun fire to it's flimsier side and rear armor could potentially wreck it's day, which is understandable as it was designed doctrinally to avoid direct ground combat. They were also employed in the conflict in Chechnya to combat insurgents firing from upper floors of tall apartment block. These floors were too high and the street too narrow to be engaged by BMP-2 autocannons so ZSU's would be employed instead. Obviously they were horribly vulnerable to rocket fire from above, but 4 23.s firing at you tends to dampen your enthusiasm for hanging out a window with an RPG..		The ZSU is one of the more popular armoured fighting vehicles made by the Soviet Union, traditionally armed with a quad-linked 4x23mm autocannon array, a search light, and radar equipment. Its primarily designed to shoot down low-flying aircraft like helicopters and occasional fighter craft, but its guns were also powerful enough to tear through lightly-armored vehicles and infantry aswell. Infact it was a common practice for Soviet soldiers to bring ZSUs whenever possible in anti-infantry operations due to their sheer lethality. In this regard, the ZSU found major use in the Invasion of Afghanistan, where often it would protect conveys within the hilly, mountainous terrain of the country. The Insurgents soon found out that quad 23mm cannons had much higher elevation than the weapons on the BMPs, BTRs and T-52s, allowing it to engage them from their ambush points on high ridges and hilltops. A special variant was deployed for that use in this conflict, lacking the AA radar in favour of increased ammunition capacity, turning the AA tank into a meat chopper. That said, the ZSU was never meant to be a front-line vehicle, so it's armor is woefully light, even concentrated heavy machine gun fire to it's flimsier side and rear armor could potentially wreck it's day, which is understandable as it was designed doctrinally to avoid direct ground combat. They were also employed in the conflict in Chechnya to combat insurgents firing from upper floors of tall apartment block. These floors were too high and the street too narrow to be engaged by BMP-2 autocannons so ZSU's would be employed instead. Obviously they were horribly vulnerable to rocket fire from above, but 4 23.s firing at you tends to dampen your enthusiasm for hanging out a window with an RPG..


	That said: the reason for the high rate of fire is that by the 1960's aircraft move ridiculously fast, going from world war 2's "''ludicrously fast''" to "there is a mosquito-shaped hole in my teeth". You have seconds to shoot at a target, so you need as high a rate as fire as possible to try and ensure you get at least one hit and at those speeds one hole in the air frame will do the trick to down a target by itself. This means that the whole concept of cannons or machine guns against aircraft from the ground is a bit of a flawed concept (except they work so obviously it isn't flawed, and loading shells with shrapnel helps when that's done on various weapons). Missiles do better due to their ability to track a target. However the ZSU has served with all Soviet states and their allies as the go-to SPAAG from its inception until today. It is mainly used today only by armies unable to field better equipment, though it can definitively ruin the day of any helicopter due to their lower speeds and operational altitudes. They’re also what you want to use guns instead of missiles on, since any low-flying vehicle is difficult to get a proper target lock on.		That said: the reason for the high rate of fire is that by the 1960's aircraft move ridiculously fast, going from world war 2's "''ludicrously fast''" to "there is a mosquito-shaped hole in my teeth". You have seconds to shoot at a target, so you need as high a rate as fire as possible to try and ensure you get at least one hit and at those speeds one hole in the air frame will do the trick to down a target by itself. This means that the whole concept of cannons or machine guns against aircraft from the ground is a bit of a flawed concept (except they work so obviously it isn't flawed, and loading shells with shrapnel helps when that's done on various weapons). Missiles do better due to their ability to track a target. However the ZSU has served with all Soviet states and their allies as the go-to SPAAG from its inception until today. It is mainly used today only by armies unable to field better equipment, though it can definitively ruin the day of any helicopter due to their lower speeds and operational altitudes. They’re also what you want to use guns instead of missiles on, since any low-flying vehicle is difficult to get a proper target lock on.


	Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.		Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.

2607:FB90:3309:53D8:AC39:65F1:4E47:4FD9: /* IRL */

2022-09-25T19:29:02Z

IRL

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:29, 25 September 2022
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	Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.		Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.

	In theory the Russians should already well prepare for this. Soviet and Russian doctrion put a lot of emphasis on AA ground assets to make up for a deficit in aircraft, (America in contrast depends on there strength in Avation hence the relative lack of dedicated Anti-air systems) do they have a ~~relativeabundanceof~~ anti air gun and missiles platforms. In practice: well Russia is getting a rough butt kicking from drones and . . Well everything else in Ukraine.		In theory the Russians should already well prepare for this. Soviet and Russian doctrion put a lot of emphasis on AA ground assets to make up for a deficit in aircraft, (America in contrast depends on there strength in Avation hence the relative lack of dedicated Anti-air systems) so they have a relative abundance of anti air gun and missiles platforms. In practice: well Russia is getting a rough butt kicking from drones and . . Well everything else in Ukraine.

	{{Soviet Forces in Team Yankee}}		{{Soviet Forces in Team Yankee}}

2607:FB90:3314:1A17:AC39:65F1:4FE5:5623: /* IRL */

2022-09-24T19:56:41Z

IRL

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:56, 24 September 2022
Line 48:		Line 48:

	Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.		Though well-aged by this point, the Shilka has gotten a new lease of life in recent years amongst armies that have to deal with Drones. The high volume and density of fire offered by its guns turns out to be a much more dependable counter than modern SAM systems to the small and low-flying attack drones increasingly used by countries like Turkey and Azerbaijan as well as a variety of Syrian rebel groups. Additionally it's more diffcult for a drone Pilot? (operator?) to take evasive action against fire even if the drone can see the source of the gunfire and if the initial burst misses. The recent performance of the Shilka, as well as its modern truck-mounted descendant, the Pantsir, has led some Western military analysts to question the wisdom of retiring systems like the Gepard. That being said, the Pantsir has been roundly humiliated by high flying mid size and above attack drones, specifically the Turkish TB2, essentially making it suicidal to face a drone equipped army without serious AA defenses.

			In theory the Russians should already well prepare for this. Soviet and Russian doctrion put a lot of emphasis on AA ground assets to make up for a deficit in aircraft, (America in contrast depends on there strength in Avation hence the relative lack of dedicated Anti-air systems) do they have a relativeabundanceof anti air gun and missiles platforms. In practice: well Russia is getting a rough butt kicking from drones and . . Well everything else in Ukraine.

	{{Soviet Forces in Team Yankee}}		{{Soviet Forces in Team Yankee}}

109.181.113.92: /* In Team Yankee */

2022-09-24T18:14:52Z

In Team Yankee

← Older revision		Revision as of 18:14, 24 September 2022
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	==In Team Yankee==		==In Team Yankee==
	[[File:Shilka Stat Card.jpg\|300px\|left\|thumb\|The Stat Card]]		[[File:Shilka Stat Card.jpg\|300px\|left\|thumb\|The Stat Card]]
	The Shilka is one of two Soviet SPAAGs in Team Yankee at the moment (we have 3 SAM (Surface to Air Missile) vehicles), and is quite a decent little machine. Like all SPAAGs, the Shilka gets the Dedicated AA and Radar Rules, which means that it can engage aerial threats with its full ROF out to a range of 16"/~~40cm~~ without adding +1 to hit.The increase of the range from 50cm to 80cm during AA shooting of the 23mm 2A7 AA gun comes from the radar taking over aiming when the target is in the sky rather the gunner using the Mk. 1 eyeball on the ground.		The Shilka is one of two Soviet SPAAGs in Team Yankee at the moment (we have 3 SAM (Surface to Air Missile) vehicles), and is quite a decent little machine. Like all SPAAGs, the Shilka gets the Dedicated AA and Radar Rules, which means that it can engage aerial threats with its full ROF out to a range of 32"/80cm without adding +1 to hit.The increase of the range from 50cm to 80cm during AA shooting of the 23mm 2A7 AA gun comes from the radar taking over aiming when the target is in the sky rather the gunner using the Mk. 1 eyeball on the ground.

	The Shilka is <s>okay at dealing with ground targets</s> comparable to an autocannon on steroids. Despite AT6 making M113s and IFVs a tough nut to crack, 6 shots with a 5+ FP are enough to comfortably defeat most APCs, vehicles, and infantry in the open. For a comparable amount of firepower, most countries would be paying double the points! Though with an all-around armour rating of 1, don't expect them to do well against things like the .50 cal that almost every American tank has bolted to the top, or anything bigger than that. You should be using this thing to defend your tanks against attack helicopters though, not putting large numbers of small holes in APCs and other light vehicles.		The Shilka is <s>okay at dealing with ground targets</s> comparable to an autocannon on steroids. Despite AT6 making M113s and IFVs a tough nut to crack, 6 shots with a 5+ FP are enough to comfortably defeat most APCs, vehicles, and infantry in the open. For a comparable amount of firepower, most countries would be paying double the points! Though with an all-around armour rating of 1, don't expect them to do well against things like the .50 cal that almost every American tank has bolted to the top, or anything bigger than that. You should be using this thing to defend your tanks against attack helicopters though, not putting large numbers of small holes in APCs and other light vehicles.

2001:67C:2628:647:12:0:0:209: /* Iran */

2022-04-29T17:56:34Z

Iran

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:56, 29 April 2022
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	[[File:ZSU-23 Iran.png\|300px\|left\|thumb\|Iran]]		[[File:ZSU-23 Iran.png\|300px\|left\|thumb\|Iran]]
	Iran also gets these.		Iran also gets these.
			{{clear}}
			===Iraq===
			[[File:ZSU-23 Iraq.png\|300px\|left\|thumb\|Iraq]]
			The Iraqi variant.
	{{clear}}		{{clear}}

2001:67C:2628:647:12:0:0:209: /* IRL */

2022-04-28T22:23:29Z

IRL

← Older revision		Revision as of 22:23, 28 April 2022
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	{{Israeli Forces in Team Yankee}}		{{Israeli Forces in Team Yankee}}

			[[Category:Team Yankee]]
	[[Category:Vehicles]]		[[Category:Vehicles]]

2001:67C:2628:647:12:0:0:209: /* Israel */

2022-04-28T21:30:48Z

Israel

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:30, 28 April 2022
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	Slower ROF than the VADS and slower movement, gains top armor 1.		Slower ROF than the VADS and slower movement, gains top armor 1.

			{{clear}}

			===Iran===
			[[File:ZSU-23 Iran.png\|300px\|left\|thumb\|Iran]]
			Iran also gets these.
	{{clear}}		{{clear}}

2600:1700:65A0:810:B9B9:B9F9:1BD4:2B85: /* In Team Yankee */ Edited first paragraph to include Tunguska

2021-12-24T20:54:35Z

In Team Yankee: Edited first paragraph to include Tunguska

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:54, 24 December 2021
Line 8:		Line 8:
	==In Team Yankee==		==In Team Yankee==
	[[File:Shilka Stat Card.jpg\|300px\|left\|thumb\|The Stat Card]]		[[File:Shilka Stat Card.jpg\|300px\|left\|thumb\|The Stat Card]]
	The Shilka is ~~the only~~ Soviet ~~SPAAG~~ in Team Yankee at the moment (~~yet~~ we have ~~literally~~ 3 SAM (Surface to Air Missile) vehicles), and is quite a decent little machine. Like all SPAAGs, the Shilka gets the Dedicated AA and Radar Rules, which means that it can engage aerial threats with its full ROF out to a range of 16"/40cm without adding +1 to hit.The increase of the range from 50cm to 80cm during AA shooting of the 23mm 2A7 AA gun comes from the radar taking over aiming when the target is in the sky rather the gunner using the Mk. 1 eyeball on the ground.		The Shilka is one of two Soviet SPAAGs in Team Yankee at the moment (we have 3 SAM (Surface to Air Missile) vehicles), and is quite a decent little machine. Like all SPAAGs, the Shilka gets the Dedicated AA and Radar Rules, which means that it can engage aerial threats with its full ROF out to a range of 16"/40cm without adding +1 to hit.The increase of the range from 50cm to 80cm during AA shooting of the 23mm 2A7 AA gun comes from the radar taking over aiming when the target is in the sky rather the gunner using the Mk. 1 eyeball on the ground.

	The Shilka is <s>okay at dealing with ground targets</s> comparable to an autocannon on steroids. Despite AT6 making M113s and IFVs a tough nut to crack, 6 shots with a 5+ FP are enough to comfortably defeat most APCs, vehicles, and infantry in the open. For a comparable amount of firepower, most countries would be paying double the points! Though with an all-around armour rating of 1, don't expect them to do well against things like the .50 cal that almost every American tank has bolted to the top, or anything bigger than that. You should be using this thing to defend your tanks against attack helicopters though, not putting large numbers of small holes in APCs and other light vehicles.		The Shilka is <s>okay at dealing with ground targets</s> comparable to an autocannon on steroids. Despite AT6 making M113s and IFVs a tough nut to crack, 6 shots with a 5+ FP are enough to comfortably defeat most APCs, vehicles, and infantry in the open. For a comparable amount of firepower, most countries would be paying double the points! Though with an all-around armour rating of 1, don't expect them to do well against things like the .50 cal that almost every American tank has bolted to the top, or anything bigger than that. You should be using this thing to defend your tanks against attack helicopters though, not putting large numbers of small holes in APCs and other light vehicles.